$22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

well, since revealing how much of a noob i am trying to give advice on here... i decided to just post hands and see what everyone else thinks...

how would you play this???

Seat 1: M_Argent ( $1950 )
Seat 2: clemdiggitty ( $800 )
Seat 3: HERO ( $800 )
Seat 4: Getoffme7233 ( $730 )
Seat 5: LSegger ( $800 )
Seat 6: dozerdude04 ( $800 )
Seat 8: bailey1999 ( $665 )
Seat 9: clitwarrior ( $670 )
Seat 10: hmatom2004 ( $785 )
Level:1
Blinds(10/15)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ Ah Kh ]
clemdiggitty folds.
HERO raises [45].
Getoffme7233 calls [45].
LSegger folds.
dozerdude04 folds.
bailey1999 folds.
clitwarrior raises [75].
hmatom2004 folds.
M_Argent folds.
HERO calls [30].
Getoffme7233 calls [30].
** Dealing Flop ** [ Th, 3h, Kc ]
HERO checks.
Getoffme7233 checks.
clitwarrior bets [45].
HERO raises [100].
Getoffme7233 is all-In [655]
clitwarrior is all-In [550]
HERO???

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

Why wouldn't you call? You're getting great odds to chase your flush, plus the chance that you already have the best hand..

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

ugh... there's 540 in dead money in there with 555 to call. if you didn't have to worry about redraws from sets/two pair, you'd call and hope that either your A or K outs were good, and that you'd be ahead some small % of the time.

i guess i call. the odds of being up against a set aren't that high - TT for either guy or 33 for the cold-caller are the only likely possibilities. so you likely have 11-12 outs for the win, and there's some chance you're ahead or tied now. close though.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

You should clap your hands, giggle like a girl and then call.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

[ QUOTE ]
ugh... there's 540 in dead money in there with 555 to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh? There's far more money in the pot than that.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

Easy call for me.

I would also put a little more steam behind your flop check/raise to get the pot a bit bigger before you push the turn. I would raise a bit more pre-flop as well.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

Yes the checkraise is weak. Or did you do that on purpose? (Building a pot or whatever.)

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

yea, this board isn't particularly scary so I may as well not chase anyone out, only thing I'm worried about is AA or trips... and I still have a good shot taking down the pot if that's the case

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

Call. When you hit your flush, espect someone to tell you what an idiot you were to call two all-ins with only a flush draw. Ignore them.

RESULTS POSTED IN WHITE
 

<font color="white">
HERO calls [555].
** Dealing Turn ** [ 3c ]
** Dealing River ** [ 5d ]
HERO shows [ Ah, Kh ] two pairs, kings and threes.
Getoffme7233 shows [ Qd, Kd ] two pairs, kings and threes.
clitwarrior shows [ Ac, As ] two pairs, aces and threes. </font>

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

[ QUOTE ]
trips

[/ QUOTE ]
See this which ought to be linked in the FAQ.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

uh.. who are you clarifying what trips means to?

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

[ QUOTE ]
uh.. who are you clarifying what trips means to?

[/ QUOTE ]You. You said you were worried about AA or trips. No need to worry about trips since there isn't a pair on the board.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

those are plausible hands two villains may have that i'm behind at this point... not by far because of the draw. Without hitting the king, I don't think I call w/ just a flush draw..

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

You were worried about a set, not trips.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

I concede. Unfortunately, I'm too busy playing to spend my time trolling definitions, looking for hairs to split. Thanks for telling me I didn't need to worry about someone potentially drawing "trips" w/ a pair I was already dominating... I know it was pretty hard to infer the intended meaning

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

Sorry, maybe I should have ignored it, or PMed you if I felt compelled to point it out. It was mostly an opportunity to link the definitions and put in a plug for linking them from the FAQ. I didn't think the post with the link was calling you out.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

and i guess my apologies are in order too, i could have responded much better, and won't forget the correct "notation?!?" in the future

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ugh... there's 540 in dead money in there with 555 to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh? There's far more money in the pot than that.

[/ QUOTE ]

540 meaning 100 from everyone on the flop + 240 pre-flop. i don't know if it's the most common way to look at it, but i like it b/c then you can do familiar estimates like pot-sized bet = need 33%, 1/2 pot sized bet = need 25%, etc.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

[ QUOTE ]
You were worried about a set, not trips.

[/ QUOTE ]
I except you're grammar supereority. Now quit nit-picking.

As for the hand, of course I fold, he's got AA and you're going to miss your flush for crying out loud.

Easy, easy call. As was pointed out, you've got odds to call based on your flush draw alone, plus the acceptable chance of you having the best hand without it.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

i wouldn't say this is a trivial call. with that action, there's a pretty good chance someone has a set, in which case you're only 25% to win. this is well below what you need for a neutral chipEV play, and way below what you need for neutral cashEV. as it was, hero had 11 outs, so about 43%. this is somewhat more than chipEV requirement, i'd guess it's about neutral cashEV. you need to be ahead somewhat often to make this call.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

[ QUOTE ]
i wouldn't say this is a trivial call. with that action, there's a pretty good chance someone has a set, in which case you're only 25% to win. this is well below what you need for a neutral chipEV play, and way below what you need for neutral cashEV. as it was, hero had 11 outs, so about 43%. this is somewhat more than chipEV requirement, i'd guess it's about neutral cashEV. you need to be ahead somewhat often to make this call.

[/ QUOTE ]

At the $22s, those times someone has a set is offset when one of them has KQ and the other has a worse flush draw.

Re: $22 TPTK -- Nut flush draw how\'s the line
 

I'd raise more initially...to like 200 or so. And of course you call the all-in. You may have the best hand as it is, and if you don't, you have plenty of outs to catch up.