Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

I know it is kind of standard to play a pair of kings (when you get them on third street)aggressively in Stud/8. I have found that in loose low-mid limit games, a pair of king is not that strong.

In many online tournaments, SNGs, and supersatellites, Party 2/4 and below, and the lower limit of available live games, there are frequently 3-6 players on third street.

Now some of them have may have hands the books say are unplayable, and the kings are probably the best hand. However, they don't play well multiway, where you are looking for at best half the pot. It is pretty difficult to win high if you don't improve. Plus people usually figure what you have and it is often fairly obvious when you make trips, kings up, or have straight/flush possibilities. However, it may be harder to read your opponents' hands. If there is much action and I don't improve, I generally fold, often on fourth street.

In loose games, I usually want to play low hands. If it gets folded around, I will raise on third street, but I usually limp or call a raise (if it is not made by an ace).

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

Welcome to the forum. Thanks for the tip [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

I am mostly a NLHE tournament player, so maybe my stud comments are basic.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

In loose stud8 games a good rule to remember is NEVER GO HIGH. Its really that simple.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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In loose stud8 games a good rule to remember is NEVER GO HIGH. Its really that simple.

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Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

You know it occured to me after I wrote this that rolled up hands are the exception :0)

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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In loose stud8 games a good rule to remember is NEVER GO HIGH. Its really that simple.

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I play a lot of short handed 1-2 stud8 on PR and I can tell you that when playing the game is 4 or less people the value of big pairs goes WAY up. Especially when people will call you down with [censored] like T73. The game has been going a lot lately and it is much better than the PS, PP games. Its not even close either.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

In low limit online stud/8 it is never worth completing with kings because of the fact that it rarely drives anybody out who was going to call anyway, and makes everyone chase against you. I usually limp in a multi-way pot and then get aggressive on 4th when hopefully a few of the lows brick as this usually does drive people out, but you need to be lucky with your position against the person who gets help with his low for this to work and also think about folding when someone catches an ace. Queens and below I just muck now from EP on 3rd because am sure they do not make enough money in the long-term and you may as well get involved with 345 on 3rd when everyone will stay with you to the river when you make your wheel!

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

I hate kings. they're one of the toughest low limit stud8 hands to play... other factors that I think about when I'm deciding to play kings (or how to play them) are:

-the size of the ante
-the liveness of your kings
-how many aces are out/ are there any aces left to act?
-how many low cards are out/ how many low cards are left to act
-your door card (if they are concealed) which may lead your opponents to believe you are going low
-your position
-I also like to keep good track of the 5's and the suits that are folded. those low draws that make straights and flushes happen all too frequently

-lane

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

I'm pretty sure you're missing a couple exceptions there, brother.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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In loose stud8 games a good rule to remember is NEVER GO HIGH. Its really that simple.

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What about aces? I usually complete with those, particularly in early position or if I have a low card.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

I guess this was kind of basic. Sometimes I feel pretty funny when there will be a bring in and 2 limpers and someone will complete with a jack showing and I will fold split kings. I know the books say kings don't play well 3-way. So I guess they definately don't play well 5-way. I find I tend to lose with high hands in these kinds of games.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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I guess this was kind of basic. Sometimes I feel pretty funny when there will be a bring in and 2 limpers and someone will complete with a jack showing and I will fold split kings. I know the books say kings don't play well 3-way. So I guess they definately don't play well 5-way. I find I tend to lose with high hands in these kinds of games.

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If my cards are live, I would probably reraise this.

I usually play 10/20 half kill, but its relatively loose. Usually though you will get rid of the bring in and one of the limpers.

Playing a pot against a worse high hand and one low hand is a good situation.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

I don't know, I mean, some people would tell you not to play when you've got an equity edge and there's extra money in the pot.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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I don't know, I mean, some people would tell you not to play when you've got an equity edge and there's extra money in the pot.

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I didn't mean to sound cocky here, it's just that I feel people are oversimplifying the situation because they're afraid to get into tough situations.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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I don't know, I mean, some people would tell you not to play when you've got an equity edge and there's extra money in the pot.

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I didn't mean to sound cocky here, it's just that I feel people are oversimplifying the situation because they're afraid to get into tough situations.

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No, I think its good to hear. There was a similar thread awhile back about playing Kings early in a SNG.

Earlier in the thread, betgo gave an example where there were 2 limpers and a jack completed. I think automatically folding there is wrong even in the loosest of games. Think your hand may be more playable now because you can leverage off that raise with a reraise and hopefully get a low hand to fold.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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Earlier in the thread, betgo gave an example where there were 2 limpers and a jack completed. I think automatically folding there is wrong even in the loosest of games. Think your hand may be more playable now because you can leverage off that raise with a reraise and hopefully get a low hand to fold.

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I don't know if that was the best example, but there is no way I am folding 3 unpaired low cards against a complete by a jack and a reraise by a king. That is almost an ideal situation for a low hand.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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Earlier in the thread, betgo gave an example where there were 2 limpers and a jack completed. I think automatically folding there is wrong even in the loosest of games. Think your hand may be more playable now because you can leverage off that raise with a reraise and hopefully get a low hand to fold.

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I don't know if that was the best example, but there is no way I am folding 3 unpaired low cards against a complete by a jack and a reraise by a king. That is almost an ideal situation for a low hand.

[/ QUOTE ]Yes, but many limpers coming in with something like (55)4 will now have to fold. you might even get one of the razz lows to fold too.

Re: Kings not strong in loose Stud/8 games
 

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I'm pretty sure you're missing a couple exceptions there, brother.

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Yes, to be fair I was. Trips are always worth playing as are 2 aces with a baby. However things like aces with a high card really aren't as good as many people think. Remember, we're assuming a loose game, people typically aren't folding 3rd for any number of raises.