Open push 20x BB?
 

Alright i was just moved to the table 5 hands ago, and sincec then i've stolen the blinds twice w/ AQ and AJ. Well then i got AK, i was up to 20xBB after stealing.. would anyone open push here? I think that if i did i'd get called by a bunch of hands that i have dominated (I think AJs/AJo+ is calling me) which should make up for any times someone has AA or KK.

I ended up raising 2.5x bb and then losing some more when i missed on the flop.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

After stealing blinds twice in five hands, I like an open push here. Like you said, I think you get called by a lot of hands you dominate.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

If I read your post right (its 530 am, cut me a break) you don't mention your position. Of course with your image, stack and hand some might say it doesn't matter. I would say from MP and LP you have a pretty easy push, but if your pushing UTG here it will be harder to get calls from AJo and the like.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

yea i was in MP1.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

Man your thinking needs adjustment.

If you push here sure you get called by more hands by virtue of your image, but does that mean that they will not play back at your normal open raise?

I mean if you open standard again you are more likely to have someone resteal with absolute garbage or a weak hand like KJ or A5, while if you open push you can basically rule out a call from these types of hands.

Sure AJ may look you up, but it would look you up (read raise) anyway if you just made a normal open...

-Jason

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

Well yea hands play back at me, but i dont like the spot i get in on the flop when i miss. I feel like my continuations are going to get less and less respect, then i let them take the pot from me then or on the turn.. and blah..

but if i push i get looked up by worse hands decently often, they don't get to push me off the hand, and i get to see all 5 cards.

It's not like i was complaining that i got called when i raised 2.5xbb... but thought maybe a push might be more +EV.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

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Well yea hands play back at me, but i dont like the spot i get in on the flop when i miss.

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If they play back then there wont be a flop will there?


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I feel like my continuations are going to get less and less respect, then i let them take the pot from me then or on the turn.. and blah..

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Basically you are complaining that you get outplayed too often ont he flop. Try stuff like CR AI on the flop when you miss if you feel like your opponent is humping you off a pot.

-Jason

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

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If they play back then there wont be a flop will there?

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I don't get what that means..


But yes i pretty much am complaining that i think i'd get outplayed on the flop too often. Guess i'll try what you said.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

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If they play back then there wont be a flop will there?

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I don't get what that means..


But yes i pretty much am complaining that i think i'd get outplayed on the flop too often. Guess i'll try what you said.

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What he meant is that you make your normal raise and when someone resteals then you just push with AK in this spot.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

I don't like pushing for 20xBB, but I might push for 12xBB, particularly if I had some people covered.

I sometimes play AK for a limpraise with something like 20xBB. It is kind of deceptive in that people will think you have a big pair or are bluffing with a standard limping hand. You can probably get medium pairs to fold and AQ might call.

It also can be deceptive in a limped pot. While you are not thrilled to fold on the flop, you can sometimes get away with a small loss.

If the table is tight, just standard raise and take the blinds. However, if it is loose and you expect callers, sometimes a limpraise is a better plan.

I was multitabling 2-table tournaments last night and when it was down to the final table, every time someone limped someone else would put in a sizeable raise. I think they really disliked limpers. I was looking to pick up AQ or JJ or something and limpraise.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

Reminds me of the Party $500k on Sunday.


3 hands in a row I get AJo (LP), AA and AA.
I raise 4x, 3x, 3x each hand.
I only stole the blinds each freaking time.

On my 3rd raise somebody commented 'LOL - you sure love to steal the blinds don't you?' or something like that....but even that comment didn't provoke anyone to play back at me.



In your situation...if it's the opening hour of a rebuy then I'm DEFINITELY pushing all-in here.

If someone has commented/complained about my steals and I think they are ready to take a stand then I might give it a shot and hope that they have any-ace and just want to 'play the odds that I can't possibly have an ace every time.'

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

What buy-in tournament is this? If you're worried about players outmaneuvering you post flop, then I'm just guessing that they aren't the type of players that will call an open push from MP1 w/AJ. They might want to, but I'm not too sure anyone is pulling the trigger with any less than AQ here, and that's if you're lucky. At a table full of donks who can't wait to get their chips in the middle, then I could justify pushing, but not here.

If I have a LAG table image and pick up AK, I'm making a standard raise, then going all the way with TPTK. You're too likely to get played back at if you miss the flop because no one expects you to have much, and in that case you don't. I'm not making a continuation bet here, because you're going to get played with wide varieties of hands postflop, and you'll want a strong holding yourself. You'll most likely be out of position unless the blinds come in, and even then I'll likely check behind hoping to make my hand on the turn. You've reduced your opponents calling requirements with your previous play, so you can't be so sure that your AK is good on any flop that doesn't contain an A or K, and you'll likely get action either way. In circumstances like those I'm check/folding AK on the flop. If I can pick up something that indicates weakness, I might raise, but I'll let go a weak hand postflop when I know my opponents are looking for a chance to punish me for my "loose" play.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

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If they play back then there wont be a flop will there?

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I don't get what that means..


But yes i pretty much am complaining that i think i'd get outplayed on the flop too often. Guess i'll try what you said.

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Pretty often someone will be like "[censored] you stop raising so god damn much and spite re-raise you. Then you go allin, and they do not have a chance to steal the pot from you.

Re: Open push 20x BB?
 

This is pretty standard.

You should pick up on the fact that people do not think you are full of [censored] if you steal a few times in a row. People are much less likely to make a move on you in my experience unless the blinds are truly big (IE 10bb stacks). I often steal in bunches.

-Jason