Backgammon Resources
 

Interested in books/internet sites concerning beginners backgammon. I did a search of amazon but came up with a dizzying amount of information which either seemed aimed at advanced players or had very mixed reviews as to the quality.

Is there a "bible" for backgammon players?

Regards,

Tao

Re: gammonpress.com
 

bill robertie (a 2 time world champion) has written many terrific books on backgammon. he also has a web site which sells, backgammon books (other authors books too), boards, computer software, etc.

thegammonpress.com

or call bill on his business line, 781-641-2091

Re: gammonpress.com
 

He was my obvious choice because of his work on HOH.

Re: gammonpress.com
 

his books are terrific, he gives lessons, and he also recommends and sells other people's books, and other products, which will help your game.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

one last thought, in addition to buying a few of the boooks bill suggests for your level of play, i think you should ask him about a backgammon program called snowie. he sells several different programs. snowie is a wold class oponent, and you can learn a huge amount playing against it.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

A few problems with the program would be that I run a Mac, so I imagine it wouldn't be compatible. Also, what is the price tag on that software?

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

I don't have much to add to this discussion, other than to say that I definitely recommend Bill's books on backgammon. He is a great writer and was even kind enough to answer an email I sent him.

Barron Vangor Toth
BarronVangorToth.com

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

Amulet is spot on: the Bill Robertie books are easily th best for beginners/intermediates. Read 'Backgammon for Winners' first, and then 'Backgammon for Serious Players'. Once you've digested the material in those (i.e. read them both a number of times and started playing a bit online) then read his '501 Problems' book.

If Robertie's style isn't for you, then try 'Starting Out In Backgammon' by Paul Lamford. Where as Robertie generally commentates on a game to impart his wisdom, Lamford focuses on a particular concept in each chapter e.g. Priming games, back games, cube-handling.

As for software, Snowie is regarded as the best computer opponent. However, it is rather expensive. Instead, have a look at GNU Backgammon as it's free, and also does analysis of positions and decisions(I think it works on Mac as well).

Hope that helps.

John

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

snowie is expensive, but fantastic. i tried running it on a mac with virtual pc, but it was too slow. there are new versions of virtual pc out, but i suspect it still won't work properly. a friend who uses macs, bought an older used pc for next to nothing just to run snowie.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

[ QUOTE ]
A few problems with the program would be that I run a Mac, so I imagine it wouldn't be compatible. Also, what is the price tag on that software?

[/ QUOTE ]

For the Mac (OS X), you might want to check out GNU Backgammon (link) I don't know how it stacks up against Snowie, but it kicks my (beginner) ass, and is freely available.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

[ QUOTE ]
snowie is expensive, but fantastic. i tried running it on a mac with virtual pc, but it was too slow. there are new versions of virtual pc out, but i suspect it still won't work properly. a friend who uses macs, bought an older used pc for next to nothing just to run snowie.

[/ QUOTE ]

Death to VPC! There is nothing in this world that angers me more than trying to run that program. It wasn't designed by microsoft; it was forged in the fires of hell by satan on a bad day. I've tried to run three versions of it and each one is successively worse than the one before.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

If you are a beginner you may find Robertie difficult. I think Paul Magriels book is excellent for the newbie and even it is challenging but I also think that Robertie is excellent. Also Woolsey has a site called gammononline and he is also tremendous as a teacher as you play against him online daily plus the archives at this site are excellent. He also is an excellent writer and has several books. I recommend reading Magriel, GNU for software, playing a lot and a daily visit to gammononline and then you can probably ask this question again and again as to further reading and study. gammononline has an excellent forum but it is also very advanced. Snowie is great also.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

[ QUOTE ]
Is there a "bible" for backgammon players?

[/ QUOTE ]

That would be Magriel's book.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

[ QUOTE ]
If you are a beginner you may find Robertie difficult. I think Paul Magriels book is excellent for the newbie and even it is challenging but I also think that Robertie is excellent. Also Woolsey has a site called gammononline and he is also tremendous as a teacher as you play against him online daily plus the archives at this site are excellent. He also is an excellent writer and has several books. I recommend reading Magriel, GNU for software, playing a lot and a daily visit to gammononline and then you can probably ask this question again and again as to further reading and study. gammononline has an excellent forum but it is also very advanced. Snowie is great also.

[/ QUOTE ]

Could you provide a link? Whenever I put in gammononline.com I get sent to gammonempire.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

bill robertie has written some very clear beginner books. his sit sells much of kit's material, dells and magriel's book too. i think robertie's beginner books are great, and my girlfriend began with those. i also think that while magriels book is impt to read, is is slightly outdated. eventually, you want to make your way to Advanced Backgammon by robertie.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Is there a "bible" for backgammon players?

[/ QUOTE ]

That would be Magriel's book.

[/ QUOTE ]
Old but gold! It will teach you the basic concepts, which will apply, no matter how far you work your way up.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

Advanced Backgammon Vol 1 and 2 by Robertie
Backammon by Magriel

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

agreed they are great! add 501 backgammon problems.
however these are all slightly advanced, if your new to bg then start with a robertie beginner book.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

also, the snowfish/blowfish programs are decent alternatives to snowie and they are free

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

true. however, snowie is really a world class opponent, from which you can learn a huge amount. i think it is a bargain.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

In my view Snowie is a fabulous product, one of the truly great achievements in gaming programming. If you're serious about getting better quickly, you should read the literature and practice several hours a day with Snowie. Its ability to analyze an entire match at once and report back with all the errors and blunders highlighted is extremely useful. If backgammon were a non-gambling game, this program would still be a must. Considering that large sums are wagered at backgammon, it's an incredible bargain.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

bill,

i get asked often about backgammon books. however, you can answer the questions much better then i can.

which books would you suggest a beginner read?

which books would you suggest an intermediate read?

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

Even on a fast PC snowie isn't that fast in 3-ply mode, especially with something else also using cpu resources. Although it is must faster than a human opponent. So I can imagine how slow it could get in a non-windows based system. It will run faster in a lower level.

By "isn't that fast" I mean like you would normally expeirence playing a game against a computer. Snowie sometimes takes a few seconds to make a move. Not a long time but sometimes it kills the timiing when you're looking for a "quick" game.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

had it for years, never found it to be a problem. maybe on an old computer with very little memor? but on 2 different machines, never noticed,

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

Keeping in mind that I'm fond of my own books, here's my list:

Beginner:
Backgammon for Winners (Robertie) - written to be a simple, easy introduction.
Backgammon for Serious Players (ditto) - really on the same level as the previous book, but shows some complex games so the beginner gets a flavor of what good play looks like.
Backgammon (Magriel) - more work than either of my books, but also much more complete. Basically for the beginner who is ready to put in some serious work right from the start.

Intermediate:
Understanding BG (Woolsey & Jones) - a collection of problems that are a little more advanced, but still accessible for the inexperienced. The question and answer format is very helpful, according to a lot of the feedback we received.
Tournament BG (Woolsey) - good intro to the issues of tournament play. BG tournament play is closely related to poker tournament strategy, one reason BG players adapt to poker so quickly.
BG Encyclopedia Vol. 1 (Woolsey) - lots of good doubling cube examples. Will bring an intermediate up to speed on the cube very quickly.
501 Essential BG Problems (Robertie) - more good problems, mostly on checker play.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

[ QUOTE ]
In my view Snowie is a fabulous product, one of the truly great achievements in gaming programming. If you're serious about getting better quickly, you should read the literature and practice several hours a day with Snowie. Its ability to analyze an entire match at once and report back with all the errors and blunders highlighted is extremely useful. If backgammon were a non-gambling game, this program would still be a must. Considering that large sums are wagered at backgammon, it's an incredible bargain.

[/ QUOTE ]

It IS a great product, but also quite a pointless expense considering that one can get GNU Backgammon which is as strong as Snowie 4, has more functionality, can play according to score in rollouts (which Snowie 4 cannot), and plays and analyzes much faster, all for free. I even got GNU Backgammon for my Pocket PC. [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

Albert

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

Compare the 3-ply mode to a lower mode and I think you'll see what I mean.

I have a newer machine and I notice the difference. I wouldn't call it a problem. However it's worse if I'm runnung something else that is using the computers resources. Running a program that emulates windows in a non-windows based machine would probably use enough resources to cause more of a problem.

Re: Backgammon Resources
 

Considering how buggy and unreliable GNU has always been, I stick to my opinion -- Snowie is a vastly superior product, although you do have to pay for it.