it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

Villains here are both decent.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. MP2 posts a blind of $15.
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 (poster) checks, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 folds, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 raises</font>, MP2 folds, Hero calls, BB calls, <font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 3-bets</font>, MP1 calls, Hero calls, BB calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 bets</font>, Hero calls, BB folds, UTG+1 calls.

River: (12 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 raises</font>, MP1 folds, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 16 BB

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

Naw, you got the the PF right. And the turn.

I think we can fold Flop as we are drawing to a not-nuts split-pot obvious hand with little implied value. Sure, I'll call a single bet with it, but I draw the line at 2bets (and I often fold the turn UI (pot dependant)) As for the river, I like check/calling. First, it is very likely that another Jack will bet for you and second, it is also likely that a flush will bet. OTOH, you're not getting many calls when the river just completed two obvious draws.

I dunno, maybe I'm leaving some BBs on the table with this line, but it sure does keep me out of situations like this. Good for the variance.

CSC

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

Pre-flop I fold. Yeah, one chip, shmun chip, with J-2 I feel like I can win a small pot or lose a large one.

On the flop, I fold for two bets. Someone might already have a straight, there's a flush draw on board, it can get 3-bet behind me, it can be expensive on the turn, I might not be the only one with a jack, etc.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

well PF and turn are fine...
flop and river look like folds.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

jeez you guys are quick...

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

[ QUOTE ]
well PF and turn are fine...
flop and river look like folds.

[/ QUOTE ]

Really? You fold the river with about 16BBs in the middle? You don't think that 1/8 times he's raising a jack or that 1/16 times he's just donking it with whatever?

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

right.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

thanks guys. PF, the BB can raise behind and I'm left a little short of EV. But 80% of the time he probably won't.

Flop yeah I shoulda folded it. But I thought that there would be so many hands staying in like KQ, TT, gutshot draws, I could make up if I hit. That's rubbish cuz even tho I'm open ended my outs can be tainted. With 4 players in when I'm faced with 2 cold for 10 SB. Getting 5:1 assuming my 8 outs are good is not too bad, but with UTG+1 calling he could have a Jack, split pot etc there could be flush draws yada yada it becomes ugly. so probably (on reflection only something like 6 outs.

turn blank is an easier call, but I feared the UTG+1 checkraise behind me (he'd called-limp-reraised the flop) if he had J9 or AJ.

river I should have folded. who is bluff raising here? nobody. I clearly suck at this point. [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

You'd have to think that if villian is decent and if he only had a J, he would just call on the river and look for overcalls since that (or the flush) are your most probably holdings.

Tough to fold in a big pot like that after calling down on a draw and completing(ish) that draw on the river.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

Preflop is fine.

Flop is an easy fold because of everything that Andy said.

Turn is fine.

The river is a little interesting. Notice how UTG+1 played his hand. He limp-3bet the flop, but then check-called the turn. This sort of play from a sane player typically means a flush draw. Therefore, that heart on the river means trouble for you. I'd be much more inclined to check-call instead of betting out.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

See, thats why I like this forum, because I was thinking WHAT IN THE BLODDY HELL ARE YOU THINKING when you complete J2o. But then I read the posts that say, PF is fine, in turn I am still thinking WTF. Then I realize hes getting over 10:1. Now I just need to play well enough, to be able to play these kinds of hands.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

i really like folding this flop...but i don't think a call is retardedly horrible...UTG+1 call 3bet the flop and his play is a flush draw at least 95% of the time so i think you can fold the river

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

I fold preflop as well. And on the flop.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

One chip too many for J2 fold fold fold. Hell I fold for 2 back to me on the flop as well here since there isn't going to be many good let alone great situations unfolding here.

I see hitting and losing, hitting and chopping, and then the least likely scenario hitting and scooping in a situation. Especially against "two decent" opponents.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

[ QUOTE ]
I fold preflop as well. And on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]Getting 17:1?

Edit: I see andy was the first to say fold preflop, and somewhat addressed the awesome odds on the call. If there are indeed hands ugly enough to fold here, J2 is certainly one of them.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post
 

[ QUOTE ]
See, thats why I like this forum, because I was thinking WHAT IN THE BLODDY HELL ARE YOU THINKING when you complete J2o. But then I read the posts that say, PF is fine, in turn I am still thinking WTF. Then I realize hes getting over 10:1. Now I just need to play well enough, to be able to play these kinds of hands.

[/ QUOTE ]
He's getting way more than 10:1. He's actually getting 17:1. At that point, you can play pretty much any 2 cards.

Re: it\'s time for a ..... misplayed on every street? post + result
 

[ QUOTE ]
The river is a little interesting. Notice how UTG+1 played his hand. He limp-3bet the flop, but then check-called the turn. This sort of play from a sane player typically means a flush draw. Therefore, that heart on the river means trouble for you. I'd be much more inclined to check-call instead of betting out.

[/ QUOTE ]

I wanted someone to tell me that [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] cuz that's what I should have thought at the time. Check-call is far better if I think he's got a flush or straight rather than give him the chance to raise if he has his flush.

Villain, as is painfully obvious, had A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]