How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

I think I have a tell. At my low to mid limits the fish probably don't notice, but I'd like to nip it in the bud.

When I flop a good hand - top set, nut straight, etc. - I can feel myself stiffen up like a board, and my heart rate jumps. Last night I flopped the nut straight in a big pot, and I thought that my chest was going to explode. In this case it didn't matter because I was at a table full of fish, but I could feel it nonetheless.

I've tried taking deep breaths, but that doesn't seem to help. I've tried diverting my attention away from the flop, but that seems unnatural and too obvious.

Help?

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

My advice is this: always try to look like you don't want to be there. Like Phil Ivey.

For instance, you flop the nut straight with AQ suited and a TJK flop, not in your suit. Two of the cards are an offsuit to you and you've got a pretty good feeling that one of your opponents is playing a high pocket pair that they might have tripped.

In this case, instead of concentrating on your nut straight, concentrate on the cards that beat you. Imagine them hitting on the turn or the river. How sick would that be? Imagine the board pairing, or that third club hitting. Now play to maximize the hands profit while trying to isolate other's draws.

I actually don't play live very often, so take my advice with a grain of salt, but thats my advice on the matter.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

That is my default play also. I flop a monster and instantly imagine the cards which are coming to beat me.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

Your opponents aren't monitoring your heart rate. As for sitting/stiffening up, I think a lot of this is in your head - or that's what I always think. It's been a while since I've played live, though.

My question would be, what do you do when a flop completely misses you? Do that when the flop hits you in the face. Your heart rate you probably can't control, but your outward appearance you certainly can - always be thinking about your next action, don't rush or take too long. Definitely don't stare away from the table, that's a dead giveaway.

Also remember that the fish are probably going to be giving you money regardless of what you do - they'll say 'i knew you had it, i just had to see it'.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Also remember that the fish are probably going to be giving you money regardless of what you do - they'll say 'i knew you had it, i just had to see it'.

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How true [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

But I want to fix this before I move up. I plan on trying out the local 10/20 game over the holiday weekend, and that game features some more observant opponents.

Thanks for the feedback, though.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

I was in the casino playing $1/$2 NL, UTG +1 with AQ. I raise to $8 preflop, and get 4 callers. The flop comes down AAQ, 2 spades. I immediately notice the waitress is very close to me, so I flag her down. I go into detail with her about EXACTLY how I want her to bring my drink.

By this time the table has been waiting and the dealer interrupts me and the waitress, "Sir, it's your action!". I glance casually at the board (I had seen them as they flopped, but noone noticed), and distractedly say "check" and immediately return to my server.

By the time the action returns to me, it has been bet $15, called, and raised to $40. I have about $200 in front of me and push all-in. I get 2 callers, one with A 10, one with K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Each player had about $100 in front of them.

That particular hand I think I successfully disguised my interest in the hand just because I was lucky enough to notice a server in close proximity and realize this may be excellent camoflage.

Normally I just try to sit exactly like I do every other hand, but this was SUCH a monster I felt I needed a smokescreen for any erratic behavior I might project.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

Experience.

Get snapped a few hundred times after flopping a monster. Then you'll be more, 'let's see if this will hold up/let's see how this goes to showdown' on the flop rather than 'oh wow!' and flipping out of your chair.

Basically, take 1 street at a time.

Remember to breathe. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

b

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

[ QUOTE ]

Remember to breathe. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]


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That alone is sometimes a challenge when I limp in after 3 callers with 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], it gets raised behind me, I call, somebody limp-redonks, and the flop then comes 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], which more than made up for all of the times last night that I raised with AQs only to get a flop of King-rag-rag with none of my suit.

Thanks for the advice, though.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

I used to be this way, and there are some remedies.

I used to count backwards from 100 by 3. This takes you mind from one place and brings it to another. Its kind of tough to concentrate on your nut hand when you are doing this.

100, 97, 94, 91.....

Another good way is to think about how you are going to extract the most from this hand and what is the best way to play it, in the meantime, you should be putting others on ranges of hands.

The best way i've handled this is through sheer experience, the more and more you play, and the more and more you experience bad beats, and draw outs and miracle things happening, the less you'll be more excited when you do flop a vulnerable nut like you did and you'll just play it accordingly and accept the result.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Experience.

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The post is titled "How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?" but it really should have been be relaxed. The only reason you wouldn't be relaxed is if you were excited or nervous, neither of which you should ideally be.

It's ok to get excited when you're cashing out, as long as you're parked close by.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

I'm pretty new to live play, but what I've been doing is watching my opponent, not the flop. I wear sunglasses so it's not so obvious I'm doing this. That way anyone looking for my reaction has to wait several seconds after the flop comes to see what i think about it.

And you'd be surprised how many people purse their lips, or start staring intently at me, and then sure enough when i look at the flop a scare card has hit.

I also riffle chips continuously, i find the motion helps dissipate some of that nervous energy.

-g

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

It seems to me trying to act calm/indifferent and then raising will give away more information than sitting up and paying attention.

I tend to look at the board and up at my opponents and back at the board as if I am thinking 'how should I play this one?'
What I am really thinking is something more like 'what range of hands are they putting me on?' and 'how do I get the most $$ in the pot?'

Also read Bernie's comments and trust his experience.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

Go limp and soil yourself.

Then they will think you just had a stroke.

No one will see it coming when, just as the perimedics are strapping you in, you push all your chips into the pot.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

Don't bother relaxing after monster flops. Just go crazy after EVERY flop, so they can't tell which one you've hit [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Go limp and soil yourself.

Then they will think you just had a stroke.

No one will see it coming when, just as the perimedics are strapping you in, you push all your chips into the pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

nh

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

[ QUOTE ]
What I am really thinking is something more like 'what range of hands are they putting me on?'

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This will also go far in finding out how to get the most money in the pot. Be aware of what else you can be representing. Be aware of how your opponents would play the hand and how they may put you on the hand at a certain point because of this.

See, lots of stuff to take your mind off of it. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

But remember, the pot isn't yours until they push it to you. Lots can happen between the flop and showdown.

b

btw...One common thing I see is betspeed in these cases. Many times I'll see a guy raise or reraise and the person he's raising barely has his chips settling on the felt when he fires his in. It's just so automatic that it's obvious what the guy has.

If you can, in your mind, downplay your hand a bit and bet as if you have a lesser, but good hand. This will also come with time. Note you can also use betspeed in that way for some bluffs. Don't play like your opponents play when you have the same type of hand your opponent would have. (make sense?) I'm talking more body language and such than actual betting. But even some of your opponents will screw up playing a nut hand. Ever see a guy sneakily wait to the turn to come alive and kill his action on a nut hand? Proudly he drags the pot even though he missed a ton of chips.

Just some more stuff to chew on, toss up and see if it sticks.

b

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Another good way is to think about how you are going to extract the most from this hand and what is the best way to play it, in the meantime, you should be putting others on ranges of hands.

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ding ding

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

A few times after I hit monster flops this summer on hands like 63o in the BB and the flop comes 633, I exclaimed "Whoa good thing I have 63o!" or "Ok who was the idiot that folded 63o..."

This makes everyone smile or chuckle, and people will think thats why you are staring at the cards.

When I showdown the hand I would say, with a smile, "I told ya so"

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

Apparently I have the gift of "no expression" when flopping monsters. I think I'm the only person out of my friends that's flopped quads and not smile the entire time.

Anyways. Just because you've flopped the nuts, or a monster flush/straight draw doesn't mean the hand is over. Just concentrate on playing the hand. You have no reason to be "nervously excited" yet. You haven't won anything yet. Play the hand.

Re: How can I seem relaxed after monster flops?
 

The reason you feel nervous and excited is the anticipation of the expected rewards of winning the hand. Rewards like the fame of adoring fans, the prestige in the eyes of your peers, the lust of poker groupies. Oh, and the $$$.

When you play poker, you should focus on playing good poker, and forget the rewards. Awareness of the rewards will also bring awareness of the risks, and both will cause you to play worse poker.

Renounce the rewards of good play, in order to achieve the ability to play your best.