30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

Hi guys. I'm new to the MHS LHE forum since I just started playing LHE. Here is a hand I played where I had a tough decision on the river. I think everything else is standard but let me know if I did anything wrong. FWIW I was fairly new to the table but opponent seemed very active and played a good number of pots.

Game is 9-handed. Villiam (UTG) limps, fold to me and I'm dealt KQo CO+1. I raise, all fold to villian who calls.

Flop is K56r, he checks, I bet, he checkraises, I 3-bet, he calls.

Turn is T, he checks, I bet, he calls.

River 4, he checks, I bet, he raises. Pot is $642. Call or fold?

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

78 goot

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

Fold.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

go ahead and pay it off.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

Fold. You're toast way more often than the odds the pot is laying you.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

Im usually a fan of CRing the draw or gutshot heads up on the flop, but I dunno if I like his move here.

EDIT: well its only not to hot if u are holding a King.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

[ QUOTE ]
go ahead and pay it off.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's what I ended up doing. He had K8dd. I still don't know if he was bluff-raising me or value raising me. Anyway even though it worked out I'm not convinced that I will be good here 1 in 11 times which I would need to be in order for this call to be profitable. I'm guessing it's pretty close, especially because I did have him on KJ-KT on the flop moreso than 87, and there is a chance he could always just be representing the made straight on the river.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

This is a clear call. Not even close, IMO.

Another TSP theory which I realize is subject to serious dispute, but it has served me well:

If I am contemplating betting the river with a showdownable hand but will not call a check-raise on said river, then I check the river.

TSP

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

[ QUOTE ]
This is a clear call. Not even close, IMO.

Another TSP theory which I realize is subject to serious dispute, but it has served me well:

If I am contemplating betting the river with a showdownable hand but will not call a check-raise on said river, then I check the river.

TSP

[/ QUOTE ]

Keep checking, pussy.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

TSP,

A lot of poker authors advise to check on scary boards if you will be extremely uncomfortable calling a raise.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

I know, but I still get called a pussy by some of the so-called experts on this site. Furthermore, if he wasn't my best poker friend, I'd kick his ass.

TSP

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

ay, its just a matter of identifying those situations. There are definitely fewer situations where you check with a strong hand versus betting it, especially online.

u should kick his ass anyway.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

i would bet this river 100% of the time, about calling his craise is about feeling, can go either way

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

I would bet the river 100% of the time also, and I would call the river 100% of the time.

TSP

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

You'll lose often, but getting 11:1, there's enough doubt to call.

Good luck.
Eric

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

[ QUOTE ]
If I am contemplating betting the river with a showdownable hand but will not call a check-raise on said river, then I check the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is pretty bad. You are surely missing out on numerous value bets if you stick to this. Either that, or you are calling raises with too many marginal hands. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Good luck.
Eric

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

I think knowing what he has here will earn you a BB down the line!

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think knowing what he has here may earn you a pot down the line!

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP

-Barron

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

I think it's the latter. I have gotten too used to the donk-like moves in the PP 15 and 30 games, I guess. I realize that my play in these spots is less-than-optimal.

But, with a hand like the instant example, I dont think there is ever a time in a PP game when it would be wrong to call the river check-raise. I should have kept my comment to that specific hand, and ones similar.

TSP

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think it's the latter. I have gotten too used to the donk-like moves in the PP 15 and 30 games, I guess. I realize that my play in these spots is less-than-optimal.
TSP

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. ppl do so much random [censored] in that game. I would call this too.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

[ QUOTE ]
But, with a hand like the instant example

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice fancy lawyer talk! Snazzy and old-fashioned both.


Must call this river. Expect to see 78 3/5 of the time.

Holla --

J

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

I think it's the latter. I have gotten too used to the donk-like moves in the PP 15 and 30 games, I guess. I realize that my play in these spots is less-than-optimal.

Oh, it's not just me, eh? Last week I played at the local club and dropped a rack before I remembered these people don't bluff anywheres near as often as your average PP opponent.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

This seems like a pretty standard call. Only has to be right 1 in 10? In that dorkfest game (Most of the time) I wouldn't be surprised to see someone flip any type of hand.

Nick

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

Sure looks like KT to me. If your opponent is reasonable you can fold.

KT? nope . . . .
 

Why would villian give up the chance to pop the turn with top two, throwing away easy $, and check on the river, risking the chance that he doesnt get in one raise with a virtual lock? Even an unreasonable player would be hard pressed to do this, let alone a reasonable one.

No way he has K10.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

after reading all of the replies i agree that it's a pretty easy call, even though i would expect to lose.

Re: KT? nope . . . .
 

I agree.

Looks more like 8-7 to me.

Re: 30-60 Stars Fold TPGK to River CR? (vomit)
 

I agree with your original post in the thread.