\"Nice Catch\"
 

$10-$20 hold'em hand I played a couple of days ago.

UTG's been in the game for about an hour. He has not appeared to of gotten out of line in any of his play as of yet :-)


He open raises. All fold to me in the BB. I look down and find pocket aces.

I 3-bet, he four bets and I five bet.

J J T (suits don't come into play in this hand)


I bet, he raises, I three bet, he four bets. I call.

J J T, 7

I check and call.

River brings a beautiful ace.

I check-raise, he three bets, I four bet (knowing I better put the brakes on pretty quick if he keeps bringing the heat).

He calls. (cool, I won't be looking at four jacks).

I table my hand. He screams, "Nice Catch!". Then slams his hand face up on the table, JT suited.

"Real nice catch, way to hang in there. Idiot"




I said nothing in return. He went on to stay and play and gamble away.


Flash forward to tonight. I'm in a 4-8 game waiting for a 10-20 seat. Long story short. I'm in the bb with 7,3 suited. A very aggressive lady open raises from late position. Small blind calls, I call (questionable at best?).

I flop a flush draw & a gutshot on a queen high flop. I check and call. We lose the sb.

I hit my flush on the turn, I check-raise. She calls.

The river is a rag. I check-raise again (I would normaly bet here but she does not ever seem to check around once she has seen a flop).


She 3-bets me. Uh,oh. What did I get myself into?

I call expecting to see a bigger flush (I already lost a flush vs flush earlier in the session).


I ask her if my flush is no good after I call?


She mucks and says "your flush is good". Flashing AQ. I table my hand and get pushed the pot.


"Nice Catch".


She calls me an idiot and tells me how bad a player I am. Then she starts on the whole table. "You 4-8 players are the worst" (as she's losing hand over fist).
After about ten minutes of her telling us how bad we play, I say...... "why don't you give us some lessons and then we'll know what cards to play".

She storms out of the room telling us about her WSOP successes and how we're all 4-8 peons or words to that effect.


If you have read this far, what do you think?

Do you always remain silent when a verbal onslaught is upon you in a poker game?


Or is there a time when enough is enough and EV can also stand for Enough Verbal?

Thanks

Howard

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

i enjoy when so called 'good' players blather their ignorance at the table like this. i think it's pretty entertaining. sometimes ill give a subtle response with a big grin on my face. trying to get more bang for my buck.

b

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

Howard:
Once or twice a while ago I'd turn to the angry player and say: "You don't complain when I play badly and lose. Why doesn't that bother you?" The results were unsatisfactory, and I stopped.

Gino

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

I was a retail store manager for years; nothing verbal bothers me. Talk all you want, just keep throwin' them chips out.

"ommmmmmmm.... I am a lightning rod, not a target ommmmm...."

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

A lot of the time when some one says "Nice catch", I simply say "You too" (since typically they surpassed my hand by catching something on the flop or turn). They don't know whether to think I am being sincere in response to their sarcasm, or being sarcastic as well. Either way, they become adequately pissed off.

-- Homer

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

I ususally don't respond to people. (Of course I always play perfect so I never get criticized ) If I dislike the person and want to tilt them I find laughing at them works well. Sometimes speaking to them very calmly in dismissive tones really sets them off. That I usually do for people who are jerks over things outside the game, not those who criticize hands and act like children about the cards. Being calm, dismissive, and insulting can be dangerous as you can push people into physically attacking you. It is sometimes a fine line when you want to tilt somebody. And I don't know that it's +EV. I usually make my decision whether to set somebody off on other factors, and I've only done it a couple of times. It is usually not the right thing to do because you are really dealing with pretty pathetic people who are hurting psychologically. The time I really did almost get physically attacked the guy was very personally insulting to me and another guy at the table. He wasn't criticizing our play. I got sick of it and sick of the fact the floor wasn't doing anything. So I said something dismissive and utterly insulting and he completely lost it. I found his biggest fear and psychological weakness and poked at it. I had to back off then because it would have resulted in violence if it went further. The floor finally did something though.

Hello,Howard! If the lady is NOW losing...
 

"hand over fist",she is probably on tilt.
At this juncture,U want to encourage her to stay and play in her "tilt mode".
In stud,when my opponent chases my big pair with 1 under-pair,and we both don't improve,I tell him that I'm "lucky" that he did not hit a second pair to beat my one big pair.
I encourage his incorrect play and make him feel good at the same time.
I do not want to chase "bread and butter" away from the table.
Sometimes,I see good players criticizing the bad players at the table. [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img]
I do not understand the logic of this.
The net result is that the bad players leave and the good players stay. [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img]
When this happens,it's ALWAYS good to ask for a table change. [img]/forums/images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]
Happy pokering,
SittingBull

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

I think you handled it well. I see this sort of thing at Mohegan Sun all the time and usually I see it as part of my entertainment....Hell, it is better than Saturday Night Live.

I really don't egg people on too much, but once after being called an [censored] for picking off someone's bluff (the exact quote was, "You and the rest of the assholes at this table can't play, and I'll take all of your money") I started to stack the chips I won from him in a different pile. I just smiled at him.... [img]/forums/images/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: Hello,Howard! If the lady is NOW losing...
 

Thanks for the input SB.

Yes, you don't want to chase away bread & butter. An older gentleman on my left said to me after she stormed out of the room, "Why did you say anything to her? Look at all those chips in front of you. Let her say what she wants to say. You've got her chips. THAT'S what counts".


Of course he is right. I was just wondering, is there a point where
enough is enough?


Thanks

Howard

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

I can relate to your Saturday Night Live comment.

This lady went on & on about how she is a regular in the Bellagio $80-$160 game (btw, I'm not saying she's not, I don't know, don't care, but I find it a little funny that she thinks it's so important to mention over & over).


She also said that all good players can tell exactly how everyone at the table plays, in ten minutes or less. That all 4-8 players are idiots and that if we come to the Bellagio 80-160 she'll kick everyone's ass.

She said to also look for her at the final table of the WSOP.


Ol King Kong got nothin' on her!


Thanks everyone for the input.


Howard

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

I just agree with them and apologize for my poor play.

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

Depending on my mood and the way I think it will affect both the table and the person in question, I say one of two things.

1. The now infamous "Shhhhhhhhhhhhh, I'm stacking your chips"

or

2. (and there are variations of this) "Spades are my lucky suit, I always hit on spades!" or "My horoscope told me that today good things would happen if I was persistant" or "I knew an ace would come, aces always come when there's a pair on the board!"

Hello,Howard! One of the characteristics of...
 

a good working player is to maintain composure under adverse conditions. This INCLUDES putting up with insulting words from unruly opponents who are making a contribution to your pot.
I play with a "Lady" who is very insulting and NEVER lets up!
However,I love to play with her because she contributes handsomely to my pot.
If your objective is to make a few bucks,it's important that u tolerate these players AND make them feel at "home". I know it's difficult. But,hey! No one promised u a "rose garden"--Roy West
If U are not concerned about winning or losing,but is interested in playing only with "nice peaople" [img]/forums/images/icons/shocked.gif[/img] ,then chasing her away from the table IS JUSTIFIED.
U choose!
Happy pokering,
SittingBull
[img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

I did it once...
 

...put a bad beat on someone that is. It was 3-bets to me preflop in the SB with Ts4s. I called out of boredom. Flop came King high with two spades. I checked and called. Turn was an offsuit rag. Checked and called. River was my spade. I checkraised, he called, I busted his flopped set of kings. And he went off. I remained silent. It was fun and funny.


If it gets them on tilt, so be it.

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

A Chinese friend of mine, who was a little lost, realized where she was too late, and made a left turn from the right hand lane of a four lane street, in the process, she cut someone off. The other party followed her, and after she had parked, and was getting out of her car he yelled 'LADY, YOU ARE THE WORST DRIVER EVER!'

She said she smiled at him, and with as much accent as possible said, 'Thank you very much sir, Merry Christmas too', even though it was in the summer.

When people are ranting and raving, and the poker lessons start, I have to admit that I usually try and tweak them a little. Ok, its not nice, but they were not nice first, so I think that they might have it coming. In the two hands, you might not have played great poker, but you were in situations where you might have had a thin edge, or not. Its poker, and you have to deal with it when it happens to you, and they have to deal with it when it happens to them.

If the lady really was an 80-160 player, she should be able to handle the loss of a pot that was really less than one big bet to her, and that might have been what I told her if I wanted to tweak her.

How about...
 

Hey, I had a 50/50 chance in making it. After they come unglued correcting you, say, "yeah, you either make it or you don't, 50/50 right?"

-D.J.

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

what i think is -- is that you are lucky. that helps in poker.


seeing that two people called you an idiot. then you have to consider that they may be correct. although they may not be. i cant help you, as i know of no remedy for being an idiot. so just hope they are wrong.:)

never let anyone give you shi** in life for any reason. just because you may get some of their money, why lower yourself and listen and take their crap. thats why we play poker, so we dont have to put up with any persons abuse. so what if they leave, there will be another two to take their place.

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

That "I'm stacking your chips" line is a riot.

I could never pull it off though. With my luck, I would either make someone cry or make someone so mad at me that they go to their car and come back into the card room with an AK-47 (with old issues of Card player wrapped all around it) with me as their first target. Just like the scene in Dog Day Afternoon but picture Al Pacino walking into Binion's instead of a bank :-)



Thanks again for the feedback everyone.


Best

Howard

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

As always, thanks for sharing your wisdom Ray.

You are the nuts!

Best

Howard

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

I've tried a few different approaches to players like that, but there is really little that makes a difference. So, now when someone announces how badly I play, I think about a stud game years ago.

I had only been at this table a few minutes when I ended up heads up with a particularly annoying lady; I had 4 diamonds showing, but all my hole cards were black. At the river, I decided to get cute and check raise her. She calls me down, and I flip up my cards to expose my naked bluff. She went ballistic, and proceeded to tell everybody at the table how bad I was to try to steal the pot from her. Fortuantely, she stayed at the table for the next 5 hours, and everytime I made a big bet or raised she told everybody how bad I was and how I'd tried to steal from her. Needless to say, I never bluffed again that night, and it was a very profitable night thanks to my "bad play" and her sqealing about it. Don't let the idiots get to you, and when you can try to take advantage of the situation.

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

I often reply in this sort of situation (even if nobody has made a comment) that I'm just following my game plan of "play bad and get lucky" - people often don't know quite what to think.

On a similar note, if you have to tell others how good you are then you probably ain't that good. This applies in all walks of life not just poker. When you have to try to make yourself better by telling others how bad they are then you are really in a bad way.

Of course, nobody on this forum has ever been there.

As long as I\'m stacking their chips in big piles.....
 

they can call me AN-E-THING that they want to...

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

There are a few players at the game I play at that are the same way. I always tell them..."it's a 7 card game".....w hen they start whinning about me drawing out on them...they hate that.. I had pocket K's one time, a K came on the river and it someone's 9's over k's boat and I thought I was going to have to box the guy...finally had to tell him to shut up...I hate it when I have to physically intimidate someone who is 30 years older than me...... [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

I WAS QUESTIONED WHEN I DREW OUT A STRAIGHT HOLDING THE 9x.
FOR THE WIN. I JUST TOLD THEM IT WAS TIME TO VARY MY PLAY. [img]/forums/images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Re: \"Nice Catch\"
 

If you don't mind being abrasive and confrontational, you look the person right in the eye (with somewhat of a questioning, dumbfounded look ... head tilted a little bit to the side, nose scrunched, and all that) and say, loud enough for everyone to hear, "do you always cry when you lose?" ... and then when their inevitable tirade directed at you is over ("you suck, you don't know how to play, blah blah blah"), you simply say (while shrugging your shoulders and turning your palms hands up fingers extended, head very slightly tilted to the other side ... in a voice of resignation) "<sigh> I guess you do".

Oh yeah, one other thing, make sure they don't have a weapon on them before you try this [img]/forums/images/icons/smile.gif[/img].

APokerGuy!