OK to check/call this river?
 

I have no solid reads on either player in this hand. It is my first hand at the table. I watched MP play over cards and he was very passive with them. Check calling an AJ down the whole way. I felt he would play an AQ the same way in this spot.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Flop: (10 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP calls, CO calls, Button folds, SB folds.

Turn: (6.50 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP calls, CO calls.

River: (9.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero checks, MP checks, CO checks.

Final Pot: 9.50 BB

On the flop and turn I'm not trying to do anything fancy here. I feel the best line is to just bet out since we're most likely ahead. None of my opponents has shown any aggression so I think our hand is good, howeve they could be on a draw with a KQ or Q9.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

I'd still like a value bet on the river here

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

value bet.

you will be raised by a better hand virtually never (unless it's a monster) and you will be called by several hands that you beat.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

Bet

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

So it's safe to assume that the best play here is to bet the river. If I'm raised can I find a fold here?

Durs

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

[ QUOTE ]
So it's safe to assume that the best play here is to bet the river. If I'm raised can I find a fold here?

Durs

[/ QUOTE ]

Getting 12.5 to 1? Eh...

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

[ QUOTE ]
So it's safe to assume that the best play here is to bet the river. If I'm raised can I find a fold here?

Durs

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If you get raised you call the raise and hope they don't show you a better hand. The pot is too big to fold for one additional bet.

Edit : And bet the river, for sure.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

[ QUOTE ]
None of my opponents has shown any aggression so I think our hand is good, however they could be on a draw with a KQ or Q9.

[/ QUOTE ]
Easy value bet on the river. They could have a Q or straight, or maybe KJ, KT, A6...

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
So it's safe to assume that the best play here is to bet the river. If I'm raised can I find a fold here?

Durs

[/ QUOTE ]

If you get raised you call the raise and hope they don't show you a better hand. The pot is too big to fold for one additional bet.

[/ QUOTE ]
Depends on where the bet comes from and what has happened. I really don't want to overcall or get overcalled. I lean towards calling for one bet on the river, but it really depends.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

Yeah, I also value bet the river. The beauty is that unless they just made a straight, they won't raise you. This means you only have to be good 1 time in 3 to show profit, and I would bet you are good here more than 1 time in 3. Plus, it could easily get checked through by hands that you beat and that would call, which turns this into a relatively easy value bet.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

Bet the river. I can't see calling if you get raised no matter how big the pot is. If they raise the river they can most likely beat one pair.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

I recently realized I've been missing value bets in this type of situation often. Bet, you'd be surprised what you get called with half the time.

It's probably prudent to fold to a raise...but I'm not sure I will without a read.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

The problem with check/call here is that if someone just paired queens they will bet - and you will call. If not it will probably be checked through. This is a disaster because you lose bets only when behind. And if the passive MP player raises the river when you bet, you know you have to fold.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

Checking here is definitely killing kittens.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

[ QUOTE ]
The problem with check/call here is that if someone just paired queens they will bet - and you will call. If not it will probably be checked through. This is a disaster because you lose bets only when behind.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is such an important point, it can't be overemphasized. With this board, only better hands will bet if you check, but lots of worse hands will call if you bet. It took me a while to really get comfortable with this concept, but you can make so many good value bets with it in mind.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Checking here is definitely killing kittens.

[/ QUOTE ]

[img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

Agreed. I think if I was raised on the river I would have to let it go. What hand that we beat would raise this river?

Durs

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The problem with check/call here is that if someone just paired queens they will bet - and you will call. If not it will probably be checked through. This is a disaster because you lose bets only when behind and, in what turns out to be the majority of the times, when you bet they will happily call you with worse hands!.

[/ QUOTE ]
This is such an important point, it can't be overemphasized. With this board, only better hands will bet if you check, but lots of worse hands will call if you bet. It took me a while to really get comfortable with this concept, but you can make so many good value bets with it in mind.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah...added the bold part for even more emphasis.

Re: OK to check/call this river?
 

I find that when you raise pf, you are more likely to get called down with 2nd or 3rd pair. Therefore, I normally value bet on all streets when I raise pf and hit top pair, even if an over comes on the river.