An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6)
 

In response to a stats post by ace in the hole, Irieguy said the following.


"Based only on your finish distributions and ITM% (which can be indicative of certain things over 500 tourneys), it looks like you probably don't play your blinds well enough in levels 4-6.

If you lose money in the blinds during these levels, you will get a lot of 4ths-6ths and be too short stacked ITM to get your fair share of 1sts."


Now, I'm having some of the same difficulties AITH was having, namely a lower ROI than I'd like and a sorry ITM distribution. This post of Irieguy's resonated with me, but I'm not entirely sure what specifics he was referring to.

Can anyone enlighten me about the key concepts in blind play at these levels? I feel like this is a real weak spot in my game, and it's definitely hurting my results.


Thanks

Burno

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6)
 

First things first. What's the deal with your avatar??

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

It's Andrew W.K.

He's a musician. Good stuff.

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6)
 

Well, many of Irie's posts are just breadcrumbs to follow. It's not always easy to get a straight answer. I remember reading that post, and I only have a faint idea of what he's talking about.

If I had to guess, start thinking about
A) pot odds
B) And I assume resteals

But, I really don't know...

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

I dunno about blind play in levels 4-6 but I do know that it's

TIME TO PAAARRRTY
PAAARTTYYYY HAAARDDDDDD

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

Bump.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Irieguy?

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

Not sure about the upper levels, but at the $11s I find that a lot of 6th place finishes means tight play that didn't get any hands levels 1 - 3. Gets you into blind trouble and you have to switch gears. I think that more 4th place finishes is indicative of other dynamics ( aggressive bubble play ), but that's only reading forums/speculation on my part -- I flame out 6th alot.

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

A heavy distro of 6ths often indicates playing too many hands early as well.

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

[ QUOTE ]
I dunno about blind play in levels 4-6 but I do know that it's

TIME TO PAAARRRTY
PAAARTTYYYY HAAARDDDDDD

[/ QUOTE ]

http://img48.exs.cx/img48/2559/partyhard.gif

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/2559/partyhard.gif

http://www.postfarm.net/uploads/partyhard.gif

http://www.hpj.cc/upload/files//partyhard.gif

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6)
 

When the blinds are 50/100 and higher, SNGs become a game of blind stealing and defense. If you have a lot of 4ths-6ths, it is often due to the fact that you are losing money from the blinds in the higher levels.


Unfortunately, I can't just tell you how to play the blinds better. It's more complicated than that. Hopefully by noticing that this may be a weak spot, you will be able to post some blind hands and get some input.

Irieguy

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

At least once a day while reading 2+2 I am very happy I don't have epilepsy or any other problem with flashing stuff. Thanks Jeff for reminding me of this pretty early today...

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6)
 

Blind play is possibly the most important part of STT play. It is possible to play from the SB/BB for a profit in this (STT) format of poker (which is not really possible in any other) and if one can do that, it's pretty much impossible to be a losing player.

Once the blinds become significant, you have to forfeit a significant portion of your stack every time you involuntarily post them. Being able to defend them optimally is very hard but of the utmost importance and, of course, is very contextual. Thankfully, there is a big bag of tricks one can use to help in this task. Unfortunately they involve reading the table well and being able to play 'real' poker, [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]. In the higher buyin levels great blind play is pretty much imperative to be a significantly winning player.

Yugoslav

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

[ QUOTE ]
Blind play is possibly the most important part of STT play. It is possible to play from the SB/BB for a profit in this (STT) format of poker (which is not really possible in any other) and if one can do that, it's pretty much impossible to be a losing player.

Once the blinds become significant, you have to forfeit a significant portion of your stack every time you involuntarily post them. Being able to defend them optimally is very hard but of the utmost importance and, of course, is very contextual. Thankfully, there is a big bag of tricks one can use to help in this task. Unfortunately they involve reading the table well and being able to play 'real' poker, [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]. In the higher buyin levels great blind play is pretty much imperative to be a significantly winning player.

Yugoslav

[/ QUOTE ]

My PT stats say i lose money in the blinds overall...but that if you take the amount i posted away...i'm a huge winner.

Is that what you mean by playing them profitably? Or are you saying there are people that are profitable in the blinds AFTER posting them?

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

He's saying the latter. Otherwise, his comment about this only being possible in SNGs wouldn't make any sense. Everyone plays the blinds profitably if you don't include the blinds posted.

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6)
 

[ QUOTE ]
Blind play is possibly the most important part of STT play. It is possible to play from the SB/BB for a profit in this (STT) format of poker (which is not really possible in any other) and if one can do that, it's pretty much impossible to be a losing player.

Once the blinds become significant, you have to forfeit a significant portion of your stack every time you involuntarily post them. Being able to defend them optimally is very hard but of the utmost importance and, of course, is very contextual. Thankfully, there is a big bag of tricks one can use to help in this task. Unfortunately they involve reading the table well and being able to play 'real' poker, [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]. In the higher buyin levels great blind play is pretty much imperative to be a significantly winning player.

Yugoslav

[/ QUOTE ]

Have you been Drinking?

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

Pretty sure he means profitable after posting them.

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

[ QUOTE ]


Is that what you mean by playing them profitably? Or are you saying there are people that are profitable in the blinds AFTER posting them?

[/ QUOTE ]

There are people that play the blinds for a profit AFTER posting them in SNGs. It's not possible in ring games (well, maybe if you are a great player and you played tiny limits you could make money in the blinds.)

I would actually be very interested to see the PT stats from the blinds for some of the top high-limit SNGers. But I don't think it'll happen.

Irieguy

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

[ QUOTE ]
Pretty sure he means profitable after posting them.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bingo.

Sorry for the confusion. No I'm not drunk but since someone else is seemingly picking up the tab at the Ritz today ([img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]) perhaps I will be in just a little bit.

Yugoslav

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

[ QUOTE ]

There are people that play the blinds for a profit AFTER posting them in SNGs.

[/ QUOTE ]

I assume we're talking about chip profit here, but I think it would be really interesting if somebody looked at the average ICM gain that players made in their blinds, though this is probably way too complicated a thing to give consistent answers.

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

[ QUOTE ]
He's saying the latter. Otherwise, his comment about this only being possible in SNGs wouldn't make any sense. Everyone plays the blinds profitably if you don't include the blinds posted.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's not fair to just look at the profit after you play either. Any decent player (and even many bad players) will show a profit after the blinds are posted due to the fact that you get to see a flop free or cheaply so often. So just because you're a huge winner after posting the blinds doesn't mean you're playing them well.

Re: An Irieguy post I\'d like to hear more about (Blind play Lvs. 4-6
 

This is a GREAT thread. I probably don't have a large enough sample size to know for sure, but too many 4th, 3rd, 2nd and not enough 1sts is where I'm at in the $50's. I checked my blind stats in level 4-6 (50/100, 100/200, 150/300) and aside from SB in level 6 I am losing money. So, how to improve? Just start posting lvl 4-6 blind hands?