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-   -   collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!! (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=299770)

cyberer 07-24-2005 11:54 PM

collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
As the subject line implies, I have a problem in my home games. We usually get the same crowd of about 14 guys around. Well lately I've been realizing that 3 of the guys playing seem to be colluding. Two of the guys are brothers and the other is a mutual friend of mine and theirs. Here is how it seems to be going when they do it. We usually play with 2 preliminary tables which combine to a big final table. So chances are 2 of the 3 wind up at one table and the other is at another table. So the 2 guys at one table go all in against each other so one gets a mountain of chips. Then the guy at the other table plays really tight and gets to the winner's table. Then the brothers are together at the winner's table. They can often be seen whispering and they both play strong and try to get even more chips. Then when the game becomes 3 handed, the collusion begins in earnest.

When it is 3 handed between the brothers and another guy, whenever the other guy folds one of the brothers also folds so that the brothers dont eliminate each other. Therefore they can wait until the other guy goes all in and both call him to ruin his odds. Then they split the money (I know the brothers split it and i assume that the 3rd guy is in). What can I do?! My home game is going to hell. Please help.

TomHimself 07-24-2005 11:59 PM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
tell them that if they pull [censored] again you are gonna [censored] them up hehe. i would just give them a warning and if they do it again take there buyin and ban them when its 3 handed

cyberer 07-25-2005 12:00 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
But theres no proof of what they're doing... theyre not obvious about it really...

ChuckyB 07-25-2005 12:05 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
You're not stupid, you know what's going on. Tell them you know what they're doing and you want it to stop. If it doesn't, they're not invited back. You'll find three other people to fill those seats.

chesspain 07-25-2005 01:01 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
1. It sounds like you allow people to pick their own seats, even at the combined final table. You can assign seats randomly, which will cut out the "whispering" nonsense.

2. You say that two of the three players will go all-in heads-up for chip dumping. If this is so, it should be obvious they are colluding when one of them does not have a legitimate hand. Consequently, it should have been obvious to everyone by now if they have been cheating. Does everyone at this game have no spine and little balls?

3. Don't allow people you don't trust to play in YOUR games, even if they are your supposed friends.

4. If you're too scared to take any action, then have your mommy call the other guys' mommies.

SheridanCat 07-25-2005 01:18 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
The simple solution is to ban all of them. If the individual guys matters to you, just ban the brothers.

Regards,

T

72off 07-25-2005 02:00 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
[ QUOTE ]
But theres no proof of what they're doing... theyre not obvious about it really...

[/ QUOTE ]

Sounds pretty obvious.

MagicMan08 07-25-2005 04:53 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
I would just talk to them about it, or ask all of your other buddies. If they also feel like this, sounds like theres a lot of other people, you talk to em and when they say something have someone back em up. Or knock their asses out early...

Rams_Law 07-25-2005 07:09 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But theres no proof of what they're doing... theyre not obvious about it really...

[/ QUOTE ]

Sounds pretty obvious.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sarcasm is VERY difficult to pull off in text. Unless he was serious, which makes it even funnier.

Lottery Larry 07-25-2005 07:21 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
Stupid question. If you don't want to give them a warning (or if you're not the host/floor) then refuse to play and start a game up with the others without the three.

If you are the host, warn them or kick them out (by not inviting them).

EStreet20 07-25-2005 11:23 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
How about telling them they're not welcome to play????

Mithrandir 07-25-2005 12:05 PM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
First of all, they shouldn't be whispering at the table. ESPECIALLY if they aren't in the hand. They shouldn't be talking at all. And if they tell anyone what they have, their hand should be dead. No one is allowed to ever say what they have as the hand is in progress. People can hint at what they have, but they can never blatantly say what they have. And seating should be assigned by drawing cards.

You've just got to work up the stones to tell them to cut the crap or they aren't welcomed back.
You say they're friends and all, but I don't think my friends would try to cheat me out of money.

PokerGoblin 07-25-2005 12:51 PM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
OK dude

A couple things aren't clear. First, you are the host of the game right?

I will assume so for the rest of my comments.

Second, has anyone else in your game noticed this? If you are the host they are looking to YOU for leadership. They will come to you instead of speaking to the three guys themselves.

If no one has said anything to you, take initiative and ask each of them individually.

How many times has this occurred? How often do you play? Doubling up in the first hand is nice but not necessarily a tremendous advantage in a freeze out such as yours, it depends on the blind structure. If the stacks are 50x > BB, starting w/ double everyone's stack doesn't guarantee anything.

Is this a high buy in tournament? Is the top prize worth cheating for?

The biggest thing is whether or not anyone else has said anything. If so, politely inform the three of them discretely that their actions in the past have alarmed some of the other players and a lot of people have asked that they not be invited back. If they continue with this iffy behavior they won't be invited anymore. Tell them you're not going to risk breaking up the game over their bullshit.

If they get defensive, tell them to leave and that will be that. If they are receptive, then life goes on.

Good Luck

PG

captswifty 07-25-2005 01:05 PM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
I can't tell in your post if they know they're cheating. Is it possible that they have no idea that they're doing anything wrong? I would talk to them and tell them your concerns.

If they don't change what they're doing, it's time to break out the cheater beater.

Lampsteen 07-25-2005 09:00 PM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
This is pretty simple. If you are getting 13 players, they simply aren't invited. If they ask why, then explain it to them. If they don't agree, then tough. [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

JoshuaMayes 07-26-2005 10:19 AM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
Don't let them play [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]??? It's your house, I don't understand the dilemma . . . .

TheCroShow 07-26-2005 02:29 PM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
oh man that sux. had this happen once, unfortunately the guys never really came back after that. just have a chat with em, tell em you are aware of what it going on, and if it continues you will have to ban them. collusion is not cool, especially at a home game!

when they go all in against each other, are the hands questionable? like, does one guy go all in, gets called and one has like 24o and the other has a decent hand? anyway, sucks man, tough situation.

utmt40 07-26-2005 05:21 PM

Re: collusion and cheating in my own home... HELP!!!
 
Just dont invite them anymore.


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