Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

I have been making some decent money the last 6 months or so and am looking to invest it. I don’t really like the idea of stocks as I am incredibly ignorant in this type of thing and when it comes down to it there are very few companies that I would like to support anyway.

I also happen to have a few friends that have been wanting to get in on making money in their underwear.

So here is the plan: I will hire a friend to beat .50/1. I will provide a bank roll, coaching, and reading material for the first 100 hours. For this time period I will pay this individual $9 an hour.

My involvement will be somewhat minimal. I expect this individual to be self motivated and dedicated to learning the game in the same manner that they would be dedicated to a job paying a little more than minimum wage. I can provide a list of reading material and the order in which to progress with it. I will spend ~1 out of every 5 hours with this person reviewing hand histories, explaining bonus whoring, sitting in on play, ect.

I expect to be able to teach my friend to beat .50/1 for more than $9 an hour within 100 hours. At this point I will take any profit that they make beyond $9 an hour until I make my $900 back plus a figure I haven’t really determined yet. Maybe another 4 or 5 hundred. Assuming they can beat .50/1 for $15 an hour this should be another 80 hours or so. So in total, this will be about a 6 week commitment from this person. (Assuming 30 hour weeks)

What I get: $500 that I wouldn’t otherwise have. I would also hopefully get a bunch of “refer a friend” bonuses.

What I give: 36 hours of my time spent hanging out and talking poker with a friend. I think that I would also learn from this as a teacher often learns as much as the student.

What my friend gets: 6 weeks of employment at $9 an hour with a substantial raise after this time period. (Not to be mean, but $9 an hour is actually a pretty decent wage for the people that I would consider hiring for this. Most of them are currently washing dishes or performing other “service industry” jobs for $6.65/hr.)

What they give: 6 weeks of their time. Possibly quitting a more stable job.

Obviously if I were to go through with this a lot more detail would be put into it, but this is just a start.

So is this a ridiculous idea?

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

This gave me an idea...

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

This is a bad idea on just so many levels. You can do so much more with your money than earning a small reuturn on what some guy grinds out in the .5/1 game.

the biggest reason this idea will never work is 1)Why is someone going to play for $9/hr for you, when if they are a winning alot more than that, they could easily just go do it on their own? It will also be completely obvious to them they could be making. So it has to be someone you completely trust 110%.

But whatever, 6 weeks of work for $500? Thats a pretty crummy investment. Especially considering the risk, as you could easily lose money over that period of time.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

I don't have many friends that I could teach to beat 0.50-1.00 for $9 an hour. The friends I have that could learn this stuff could beat 20-40 within a few months, I think.

-Michael

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

[ QUOTE ]
I expect this individual to be self motivated and dedicated to learning the game in the same manner that they would be dedicated to a job paying a little more than minimum wage.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you over estimate the self motivation most people have while working for just over min wage. There is a reason most workplaces with low wage employees have very hands on management keeping a close eye on their work.

I also think you under estimate the difficulty in beating the Party .5/1 for 9 dollars an hour for someone you have just taught how to beat the game - the rake structure of this game means beating the game by a large degree to be able to crank out 9 dollars an hour -

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

do you have any math showing hands per hour and a winrate that could prove this anywhere near possible?

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

[ QUOTE ]


the biggest reason this idea will never work is 1)Why is someone going to play for $9/hr for you, when if they are a winning alot more than that, they could easily just go do it on their own?

[/ QUOTE ]

This person I'm talking about has never played poker in his life. I expect they would be losing money for the first while rather than making more than $9 an hour. This person has also considered doing it on their own, but do not have the money to get started, and it would take them A LOT longer to learn on their own, rather than with my coaching.
For the first 100 hours they will be aware that I am paying them more than they are worth, and for the last 80 hours they will realize that they could be making more on their own. I see it as evening out the money they would make over 180 hours and I would hope they would see it this way too.

[ QUOTE ]
It will also be completely obvious to them they could be making. So it has to be someone you completely trust 110%.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is why I would do it with a friend rather than hiring someone random. I do trust this person 110%.

[ QUOTE ]

But whatever, 6 weeks of work for $500? Thats a pretty crummy investment. Especially considering the risk, as you could easily lose money over that period of time.

[/ QUOTE ]

I realize this isn’t the greatest moneymaking scheme of all time. It's more like I was thinking that I would like to make some passive income, hang out with a buddy, and get my friend out of washing dishes.

I also feel fairly confident that most intelligent, dedicated people can easily learn to beat .50/1 over this time period. And if they start on a downswing and it takes longer it isn’t really a huge deal.

Thanks for the comments so far.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

[ QUOTE ]
do you have any math showing hands per hour and a winrate that could prove this anywhere near possible?

[/ QUOTE ]

My winrates after 5 months of poker:

60 000 hands at 2BB/100 x 4 tables = $4/hr
Clearing a 7x bonus pretty much constantly = $18/hr
Approximately $22/hr in USD
I live in Canada so…
22 x 1.22 = $26.75/hr in Canadian money.

If you want to get really serious without any extra training you can mix in some casino whoring which at a conservative estimate should be about $35/hr

So: (26.75 + 35) / 2 = ~ $31.25/hr

So I think that with coaching $15/hr after 180 hours is reasonable.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

My roomate is fairly decent at poker, better than breakeven at the lower limits. You know what I did? I just put money in his account and let him play! I did not get a cut of the money, I just gave him the cash when he didn't want to play any more.

I wish more people would be like me [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

[ QUOTE ]
My roomate is fairly decent at poker, better than breakeven at the lower limits. You know what I did? I just put money in his account and let him play! I did not get a cut of the money, I just gave him the cash when he didn't want to play any more.

I wish more people would be like me [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

But did you pay him to play? The reason I want to do this is so that my friend can quit his shitty job and I can actually dedicate some time to teaching him properly.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

[ QUOTE ]
I expect to be able to teach my friend to beat .50/1 for more than $9 an hour within 100 hours. At this point I will take any profit that they make beyond $9 an hour until I make my $900 back plus a figure I haven’t really determined yet. Maybe another 4 or 5 hundred. Assuming they can beat .50/1 for $15 an hour this should be another 80 hours or so. So in total, this will be about a 6 week commitment from this person. (Assuming 30 hour weeks)

[/ QUOTE ]

He would need to be a 3BB/100 winner from the start of this just to get your 900 back. If he 4 tabled the .5/1 6max game and could beat it for 3BB/100, then he would play about 300 hands / hour.

If he played 30,000 hands after 100 hours, he would then be up $900.

It would take you an additional 55.5 hours to collect your $500 profit.

So you are looking at a project which takes you 155.5 hours to complete.

Your expected return is $500 = $3.22 / hr

Your risk is the bankroll you give him + his salary.

This seems like an awful lot of work for $3.22 / hr, especially when you realize that he will probabaly not accomplish this for a much longer period of time than you think, if at all.

I don't think this is a good idea.

A better way to do it would be to set him up with a rakeback account under your name, and teach him how to play or just play him yourself, HU. (Just kidding about the HU part.)

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
My roomate is fairly decent at poker, better than breakeven at the lower limits. You know what I did? I just put money in his account and let him play! I did not get a cut of the money, I just gave him the cash when he didn't want to play any more.

I wish more people would be like me [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

But did you pay him to play? The reason I want to do this is so that my friend can quit his shitty job and I can actually dedicate some time to teaching him properly.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I just gave him money that he won, in cash. After a good ammount of time had passed and he wasn't going to lose it all back or something.

Anyways, my roomate is the poorest college kid I know and once I buy some new monitors I'm going to try and persuade him to use my old computer/monitor setup to make money at the lower limit SNGs instead of being such a poor bitch.

I probably won't even take a cut of his winnings because I don't really care, I'd rather see my friend with the money than me.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

He could make 0BB/100 and still make $15 an hour through bonuses over 180 hours...

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

I'm all for helping out friends, but I just don't like this plan. The time you waste helping your friend would be much more valuable if you simply improve your own game and increase limits. But if you're really interested in helping him out, I think a better approach is to just bankroll him for $.50/1 ($300), go over a few things with him and let him put in the hours on his own. If he wins good, if not, oh well.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

[ QUOTE ]
My roomate is fairly decent at poker, better than breakeven at the lower limits. You know what I did? I just put money in his account and let him play! I did not get a cut of the money, I just gave him the cash when he didn't want to play any more.

I wish more people would be like me [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

That's what i did too with my roommate. I want friends who are into poker and have money and that's what I get from getting him going. So worth it.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

Stop training more sharks, god dammit! Give them Hellmuth's book instead!

[img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

where are you clearing such a good bonus?

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

Great plan to be a nice friend. Bad plan to make any money.

Are you talking about NL?

How many games do you expect this person to play at a time?

When I converted to online play, I started back at .50/$1 limit and three tabled. I made $10.50 per hour during my first 100 hours...............if you buddy does this well, there sure isn't much profit for you.

Good luck.

Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

Along the lines of what others have said, do this for your friend, not for your own investment.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

[ QUOTE ]


That's what i did too with my roommate. I want friends who are into poker and have money and that's what I get from getting him going. So worth it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ding!

GoT

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

you'd do much better setting him up with R******* under you.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

OP I have some magic beans for sale that would be a much wiser investment...PM if interested.

Re: Hiring a friend to beat .50/1
 

I know you're probably a young guy cassette but if you ever want to retire you better start learning about the magic of compund interest in regards to investing.