The Mouth at again
 

Personally I think the penatly should worse for each infraction not just another 10 minutes. 10 minutes for the first, 15 for the second, 30 for the 3rd and either an hour for the fourth or kicked out and on #5 out of tournament so Mike should serving about a 2 hour time out not a 40 minute one.

RZ

[ QUOTE ]
Date / Time: 2005-07-09 11:45:00
Title: Mouth Breaks the Silence
Log: "Floor on 127!" are the first words audible today, over the sounds of the clicking chips. Tournament Directors are called to the very table at which Mike Matusow sits, where he's being accused by a dealer of throwing cards. He's immediately assigned a ten minute penalty, but he adamantly and politely defends himself, and is supported by the rest of the players at the table. He's let off with a warning, but not more than a few seconds later, still steaming from the accusation, he let's the F-word slip. "Now I have to give you a 10 minute penalty," says Tournament Director Louis "You can't say the F-word." "F___ that," says Matusow. "Twenty minutes." "F_____n' great." "Thirty minutes." As Matusow leaves the area, he manages to fire off one more F-Bomb, rounding out his penalty to forty minutes, and starting a small round of applause from a crowd who up until this point, had been quite silent, and is now chatting away. Leave it to Mike "The Mouth" to get people talking.



[/ QUOTE ]

Re: The Mouth at again
 

That is funny [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: The Mouth at again
 

Personally, I don't think there should be any penalty.

Do players in the NFL get a penalty if they swear after dropping the ball, or if the quarterback yells fu[/i]ck after throwing an interception, or if a batter in baseball is pissed that he swung and missed and lets out a little frustration????

This is the big leagues, and players are going to be playing with everything they got. Other sports don't punish it, why should poker?

Now, if you were swearing at a person or trying to insult them with swears, then that defnitely deserves a penalty, but just dropping the f-bomb out of frustration, not directing it at anyone does not really deserve a penalty, IMO. This isn't freaking kindegarden.

EDIT: However, I rarely swear myself (probably never would at a major tournament in public), so I guess I should support the rule since it would most likely only help me and never hurt me, but I still think it is a dumb rule. After all, we are all adults.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

no, your idea is even worse than having the pathetic rule in the first place

has anyone even been able to come up with an decent argument for introducing it?

anyway, hopefully it keeps mike out of trouble and he goes on to win the damn thing, it'd shut this forum up for a while

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
Personally, I don't think there should be any penalty.

[/ QUOTE ]
Count me in on that as well. This isn't Augusta. We're talkin about poker in Vegas. Not Golf. This ain't Wimbledon. This is Poker. Poker.

AI

Re: The Mouth at again
 

If you are bothered that much by a word you need to be at Church instead of the WSOP.

How can you be a gambler and be affected by a WORD!!!!!! Thats comedy.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

What if this situation ever came about:

You just took a horrible beat late in a tourney. Now you are short stacked. You dropped a couple f-bombs after some donk caught his 2-outer on the river.

You get a 20 minute penalty, in which time you get blinded out of the tournament. Is this fair?

Re: The Mouth at again
 

I agree that the F-bomb rule is bogus, but they had to penalize the Mouth for this type of behavior. He got away with throwing the cards, but couldn't let it go. Then, he is simply acting like a little spoiled child to continue dropping the F-bomb knowing it would add to his penalty. He deserves everything he got here, and this is just one more example of his self-destructive ways.

As to the football analogy, they do penalize for taunting and other unsportsmanlike conduct. I suggest that if a player got into a camera, got into the crowd and started dropping the F-bomb there would be some penalty at some point.

There does have to be some level of acceptable/unacceptable behavior. For example, Tony G's latest rant in Paris should have been handled by someone coming over and telling him to chill out or get a penalty. Especially when he started banging the rail and making stupid threats. Just another example of why they have to have some rules ... wish it wasn't so, but it is.

NCAces

Re: The Mouth at again
 

It's a stupid rule, plain and simple. First off, this isn't being shown on live TV (is it shown on the internet live?) so they have more than enough time to edit anything out. Second, what's the point of the rule, to send a message to kids who shouldn't even be gambling in the first place?

I think the real point of the rule is to help prevent dealer abuse and all that kind of stuff, but it clearly does nothing to deter it.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

If there is going to be a rule with a penatly then it should have more teeth and get harsher for repeat offensives. I think maybe a warning should be introduced but Mike just kept pushing it and he should be bounced if he knew the penalty was going to get worse and a chance of him getting thrown out he would never have pushed it that far.


RZ

Re: The Mouth at again
 

so the rule say you just cant say [censored]?????
what about [censored] [censored][censored][censored][censored][censored] and [censored]?

Re: The Mouth at again
 

how about tits, winkle, and vibraphone?

ok?

how about wankle rotary engine?

Re: The Mouth at again
 

In the TDA rules, the penalties go 10, 20, 30, 40, DQ.

Kevin...

Re: The Mouth at again
 

Richard Vernon: You're not fooling anyone Bender. The next screw that falls out will be you.
Bender: Eat my shorts.
Richard Vernon: What was that?
Bender: Eat... My... Shorts!
Richard Vernon: You just bought yourself another Saturday.
Bender: Ooh I'm crushed.
Richard Vernon: You just bought one more.
Bender: Well I'm free the Saturday after that. Beyond that, I'm going to have to check my calendar.
Richard Vernon: Good, cause it's going to be filled. We'll keep going. You want another one? Just say the word say it. Instead of going to prison you'll come here. Are you through?
Bender: No!

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
In the TDA rules, the penalties go 10, 20, 30, 40, DQ.

Kevin...

[/ QUOTE ]

So if Mike drops one more F-bomb the rest of the way he's DQ'ed???

Would make for some great TV if The Mouth gets heads-up for the title, takes down an all in which leaves his poor opponent with hardly a BB left and he lets out a "Fvcking-A!!"

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
Is this fair?

[/ QUOTE ]

sure it's fair. it may not be 'right', but it's fair. any rule that applies to EVERYBODY that doesn't give anybody else an advantage is fair. if everybody knows about the rule ahead of time, it's fair.

if the rules change in the middle of the tourny, that's unfair. if the rules are biased against one subset of competitors (i.e. you get a penalty if you AREN'T wearing a WSOP gold bracelet), that's unfair.

any rule that effects everybody equally, is biased towards nobody, that everybody is made aware of, is fair. just because somebody doesn't "like" the rule doesn't make it unfair.

Josh

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]

You just took a horrible beat late in a tourney. Now you are short stacked. You dropped a couple f-bombs after some donk caught his 2-outer on the river.

You get a 20 minute penalty, in which time you get blinded out of the tournament. Is this fair?

[/ QUOTE ]

This exact scenario happened already to Jen Creason (sp??) in the razz event. She was eliminated while serving her penalty. The rule is directly affecting WSOP results.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

the penalty is bogus but the rule is there so its up to the players to control themselves, Mike obviously cant. hopefully next year the rule wont be in place but seeing how players like Mike give it reason to be there I doubt it goes anywhere.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

It's fair because its a clearly stated (and heavily advertised and discussed to the point where you'd have to be an idiot not to know the rule).

Its unfair because it's not being enforced consistently.

If you would have asked whether it was a good rule, I'd have to say it's f@##ing stupid.

Taking my ten minute penalty now..... [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
In the TDA rules, the penalties go 10, 20, 30, 40, DQ.

Kevin...

[/ QUOTE ]

So should Mike being setting out 1 hour and 40 minutes not just 40? I know he got all of them at the same time but he shouldn't be able to serve them currently. Finish the first 10 minute, then serve 20 more and so on, looks like they are just making him do the 40 and covering the others.
But maybe Cardplayer got it wrong and the penalty wasn't rounded up the director said thats 10, thats 20, thats 30 and thats 40 maybe he wasn't giving the total time but the time for each penalty.

RZ

Re: The Mouth at again
 

Why has no one attempted to argue they said "Fug"?

Stupid approach?

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why has no one attempted to argue they said "Fug"?

Stupid approach?

[/ QUOTE ]

Fugging stupid

Re: The Mouth at again
 

It's pretty obvious Mike did it on purpose just to set off fireworks. It's 40 minutes at 25/50, how much is he going to realistically lose in blinds in that time. 300? Maybe 375?

It's funny that the f word is bad but that I could've been at the table with Annie Duke yesterday when she pulled her "he checked" stunt, have called her an "angle-shooting c.u.n.t.", and not gotten anything for it.

The rule's bad.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

Is this correct?

"He loses a hand, throws his cards into the muck which hit the dealer in the face, then tells the dealer to shut up! Instant 10 minute penalty."

Yes, this is MM we're talking about. I'm starting to think this man is disturbed and in need of help.

source gutshot.com

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
Is this correct?

"He loses a hand, throws his cards into the muck which hit the dealer in the face, then tells the dealer to shut up! Instant 10 minute penalty."

Yes, this is MM we're talking about. I'm starting to think this man is disturbed and in need of help.

[/ QUOTE ]Except that when it happened and the floor initially gave him a ten minute penalty for that, he was polite and that several people at the table stuck up for him so they actually let him off with a warning.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

I dunno.. Blinds at 25/50... he drops the bomb just up to before he would get disqualified....

Prop bet??? ;~)

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Is this correct?

"He loses a hand, throws his cards into the muck which hit the dealer in the face, then tells the dealer to shut up! Instant 10 minute penalty."

Yes, this is MM we're talking about. I'm starting to think this man is disturbed and in need of help.

[/ QUOTE ]Except that when it happened and the floor initially gave him a ten minute penalty for that, he was polite and that several people at the table stuck up for him so they actually let him off with a warning.

[/ QUOTE ]

Then it's fine and life goes on. I've never had the privilege to meet this individual in person but all one hears is negative. Ah well....

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]

It's funny that the f word is bad but that I could've been at the table with Annie Duke yesterday when she pulled her "he checked" stunt, have called her an "angle-shooting c.u.n.t.", and not gotten anything for it.

[/ QUOTE ]


If this is true...then if I were Annie I would have called the floor and told them and asked for a penalty (although I don't know if one would have been given).
I think this is equally inappropriate.


i still like the rule in general and believe Mike got exactly what he deserved.

It's not about cleaning it up for TV. It's just a matter of acting like an adult.

There are a lot of spectators, older folks and women who are involved in poker.
There's no point in just dropping f-bombs everywhere.

Yes, it's poker and it's Vegas. But I'm also not allowed to say f'ck at the blackjack table either. And if I were to be sitting there occasionally shouting it out I would be asked to leave because it's bothering and possibly offending the other players.
I'm no puritanical christian or anything...and I cuss all the time. But I believe that dropping the f-bomb in these situations should get SOMETHING.

They obviously made the rule as it is because they don't feel like trying to distinguish EVERY time someone says it whether or not it was AT someone.
If the floor wasn't there then the infractor can just say 'it wasn't AT him...I just mumbled it.' and there are many situations where you just can't be sure if this is how it really happened.
So, for simplicity sake, they just said "Look...these are adults who should be able to control themselves...and we've had these guys dropping f-bombs all over the place during every event in past years. Let's just get rid of it entirely because it's really obnoxious."

I completely agree.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

I wonder if Molly Ringwald was there pleading with him to stop while Anthony Michael Hall tallied the total penalty.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

"sure it's fair. it may not be 'right', but it's fair. any rule that applies to EVERYBODY that doesn't give anybody else an advantage is fair"

This is completely wrong. The rule is not equally enforced. Since 99% of players and 95% of dealers think it's stupid, most of the time it isn't enforced (I heard the f-word about 20 times and the floor was never called). It's enforced when someone lets it slip and someone else doesn't like them and calls the floor, or if it is randomly said in front of one of a select few goody-good dealers. So the rule is not only completely stupid, it's also unfair.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
"sure it's fair. it may not be 'right', but it's fair. any rule that applies to EVERYBODY that doesn't give anybody else an advantage is fair"

This is completely wrong. The rule is not equally enforced. Since 99% of players and 95% of dealers think it's stupid, most of the time it isn't enforced (I heard the f-word about 20 times and the floor was never called). It's enforced when someone lets it slip and someone else doesn't like them and calls the floor, or if it is randomly said in front of one of a select few goody-good dealers. So the rule is not only completely stupid, it's also unfair.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wrong. The rule is still fair. The enforcement isn't. And this isn't just being nitpicky.

Who enforces the rule? It's the floorstaff. It's not the dealers. It's not the players. IT IS UP TO THE FLOORSTAFF to enforce it. Nobody has ever said "hey, the floorman knew about person X saying F***, but he didn't do anything about it".

As such, I'm assuming that hasn't happened. Everybody is whining about it not being enforced fairly. Well, in everything that I've read and in the WSOP events I played, EVERY TIME the floorstaff was notified, it was enforced.

Your claiming of it not being fair is VERY similar to a person saying the law "you can't kill people" isn't fair. Sure, not every perpetrator gets punished. But when the 'law' enforcement knows about who the 'criminal' is, it is enforced.

The rule applies to everybody. The rule is fair.

The dealers/players don't report everybody. Thus, it is the players/dealer who aren't being fair.

This is really amazingly simple.

Josh

p.s. Nowhere do I say that I'm in favor of this rule. I'm not. I'm also not in favor of 65 mph speed limits. But the speed limit is 'fair'. I'm just sick of the misplaced whining here.

Re: The Mouth at again
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, it's poker and it's Vegas. But I'm also not allowed to say f'ck at the blackjack table either.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are if you're betting $1000 a hand.