My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

from the other thread on this:

[ QUOTE ]
Does any significant MGR producing or VIP Empire player have the balls to send them an email asking if it's safe to keep funds there and ask why they are shutting down accounts?

[/ QUOTE ]


Sure...why not?


As I've stated previously...I don't think that taking a 'sky is falling' attitude is appropriate. But I do think that empire's non-response policy on this issue is kind of annoying.

I'm sure they're getting bombarded with e-mails about this and they have a history of not responding anyway so we'll see if anything comes of it.


--------------------------------------


Please forward this to management or the appropriate person at empire poker:


Hello,

I consider myself a member in good standing at Empire Poker. I am a VIP member and also in the Royal Flush Club. I am close to the 25,000 VIP points to get that handsome TV I see on the web-site.
While I have some disagreements with the points structure at Empire I do like what your site is trying to do in order to encourage play. Examples of your site's generosity that I have enjoyed include the free watch and monthly $100 bonus at 15k points, the freeroll for those who make the tourney-masters board, the 2k VIP points buy-in WSOP freerolls, the other WSOP freerolls where you need 3k raked-hands in the month in order to register, the royal-flush club freerolls, and other reload bonuses available to all players.


Keep the good work in this regard.
We players enjoy the various incentives and bonuses that your site is giving us.


I would now like to address a recent issue which is of great concern to many players I know who play on your site.
This issue involves the sudden closing of many accounts. There is even talk that some players are having their funds confiscated.
Additionally...these players are being told to contact empirepoker regarding the status of their account but never get any answers as to what they are supposed to do. They either get some sort of run-arounnd or get told to call back in an hour or something along those lines.
It is very frustrating for some of the players who were logging-in with intentions of playing at your site to learn that their account has been locked or closed and that there is nothing they can do about it.


I understand that empirepoker has the authority to close accounts as they see fit. And it seems that some players have gotten some information that the reason their account has been closed was due to not consistently playing there except during bonus-reload periods. But this does not appear to be the case with everyone involved.

Additionally, there are some players who are saying that if they had received any warning whatsoever regarding the status of their account they would have been happy to play more there if they could have avoided having their account closed.
It seems there could have been better ways for empire to handle this situation.


I have to say that I don't feel my account is in jeopardy at all since I am a regular player there. But I have to wonder what is going on. If this many people are suddenly having their accounts closed should I feel like there is a possibility that the same will happen to me?

I have a reasonabe sum of money at empirepoker right now and I wonder if I should feel comfortable keeping so much money in there.
I know many players who are saying that they will likely keepo much less money on hand at empire because they acknowledge the chance that empire might close their account and/or take their money.
I have a hard time disagreeing with this sentiment.
A site which I once trusted does not seem to be as trustworthy as far as I can tell.


In short - none of the players seem to know what's going on. many people are concerned. some of us would like some answers.


Please be aware that I will be sharing your response to this e-mail with some fellow empirepoker players I know on the 2+2 forums.


Thank you,
Robert xxxxxxx
empire handle - xxxxxxxx

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Just curious, how much money do you keep there usually?

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

It should be interesting to hear what they have to say. I e-mailed them earlier today, asking them to clarify the conditions under which they will close an account. All they would say is that it is a management decision, and that my account is in no danger of being closed now or in the future.

Hopefully you can learn more.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Not as much as I probably make it sound like in my little letter...certainly not as much as many typical 15/30 or 30/60 players.


Right now my balance is at about $5k.
I just took out $3k a couple days ago (was at $8k).
Kind of typical. I'll try to build my $4k or so up to about $7k and then pull some of it out. Something like that anyway.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Two to one they write back and tell you they can't reply to you by phone,so please call them. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I can't believe that Bob is willing to sacrifice his $4,000 just for us. What a nice guy. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

well written...interested to see how they respond.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

$50 says you get a generated form letter back.

bahahaha

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Is that what they really said??
or was that a typo by the poster who said that?? (maybe it was Vern...can't remember).

either way...it's kinda funny. But I doubt I'll be blessed with such an amusing response.


You would be better to say 2:1 I get no response at all!!



Completely non-related...but while typing this I just noticed the latest whine-fest fish at my table is named 'AssSpanker' which I found kind of amusing.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

This is starting to remind me of the Empire500 fiasco last year . . .

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

yup.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I have written numerous times to them this evening. Politely to begin with... maybe not that politely at the end [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
They don't care to answer [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]
I feel so unsatisfied..... [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Yeah, I have been asking to speak with a supervisor and continue to get stone walled. The help line refers me to vip, vip is no longer returning my e-mails.

All the party skin's warning e-mails start out with, "We tried to contact you at the number you listed but could not make contact." I even got one of those after I called the help line, verified the phone number was correct and was waiting for a callback [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Vern

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, I have been asking to speak with a supervisor and continue to get stone walled. The help line refers me to vip, vip is no longer returning my e-mails.

All the party skin's warning e-mails start out with, "We tried to contact you at the number you listed but could not make contact." I even got one of those after I called the help line, verified the phone number was correct and was waiting for a callback [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Vern

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Vern

We have been unable to contact you at the phone number you provided when signing up and need to speak to you in order to validate your account.

Please call us back from the number registered on your poker account. This will enable us to serve you better in protecting your account information.

Call us at +1 (866) 299-8893 (Toll free for US & Canada only) or +350 41003 (International Rates Apply). We are available 24 hrs, 7 days a week and will be glad to assist you.

If you would prefer we contact you, please reply to this Email with a convenient time for us to call.

If we do not hear from you, your poker account will be temporarily put on hold to ensure your online safety until we are able to speak to you.

Looking forward to hearing from you!

Kiran Kumar
Credit Team
ts@pay-pro.com
+1 (866) 299-8893 (Toll free for US and Canada only)
+350 41003 (International Rates Apply)
http://www.pay-pro.com<br />
[/ QUOTE ]

Called within an hour of this being posted and was told they would do some research and call back in an hour. I think it was about 8-10 hours later, no call, simliar e-mail that they could not get through and then bam, the door slammed shut.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I've decided this might actually turn out +EV for my banned self. I'll close the account I have now, open a new one with a new name/address/neteller etc. and sign up under the affiliate giving away playerview. Now, I have Empire rakeback, and free playerview, affiliate is making $$$, I'm a positive player to Empire, and Amir get's some cash. EVERYBODY WINS!!

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I hope you guys will not give up. It was clear to me that their insistence on the closings being "irreversible" is an indication that they are worried about PR and relentless follow up by the people who have been banned.

Empire is afraid of how big a reaction they get here. There behavior shows this clearly.

[b]Keep at it. Pester Empire. Share your story on other poker forums and RGP. Share the word of what Empire is doing.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

this email is too long for a party skin. It would take the 35 monkeys that run it 35 years at 35 typewriters to come up w/ a fiting reply.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Now that's what I call customer service!!!


Pretend like you tried to reach the customer and then give them the run-around when they are finally able to contact you.
Then pretend AGAIN that you are trying to reach them even though you aren't.


"Dear Empire - Your repeated failed efforts to contact me have me greatly concerned as I know you have my correct phone number and certainly wouldn't be so bold to merely CLAIM that you were trying repeatedly to call me when you actually weren't.
This seems to happen quite a bit when you guys try to call me and I wonder how many other important calls I may have missed that I never even knew about.
I have notified my phone-company that I am very upset that phone-calls to my home are not going through. They claim that there is nothing wrong with my phone-line but I know thatr they are lying because you guys have so frequently been unable to get through.
I have told the phone-company that I am not going to pay the bill for such terrible service and that if reliable sources continue to tell me of their troubles getting a hold of me I am going to go down there and fire-bomb their building."

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

[ QUOTE ]
I've decided this might actually turn out +EV for my banned self. I'll close the account I have now, open a new one with a new name/address/neteller etc. and sign up under the affiliate giving away playerview. Now, I have Empire rakeback, and free playerview, affiliate is making $$$, I'm a positive player to Empire, and Amir get's some cash. EVERYBODY WINS!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey don't forget you get a new sign-up bonus as well.
GREAT IDEA, I might do this myself, a couple of dozens new accounts, new sign-up bonuses, tuesday reload bonuses, etc...
Now that I have been judged and condemned, I might as well commit the felony.... hehe [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

LMAO

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I was hoping that this would confuse toe front-line of CS personnel to such an extent that they would be forced to forward it to someone who might have a chance of understanding.


I would like to say, 'should be interesting' but I really doubt anything interesting will come from this except for their lack of response and/or inability to address the issue.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Oh, and here is the thread of e-mails with support that I had. Sorry for the grammer, it was late (by my standards) and I did not pay close attention to it. Also note, that one typo was really bad. I meant "I don't deny you have right..." but I think the reader should pick that up from the context. Also, the e-mail change was validated and done on all skins at the same time, about 5 days prior to the first e-mail from pay-pro, so I still have one e-mail and my real name/address for all of my skin accounts, one at each.

Vern

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Empire,

I received the attached e-mail this morning and called. The first person I spoke to advised she would call back in an hour, that was at 7:30am Eastern. I received no call back and just called again. I was advised to send this e-mail, so you could contact me. I will be up for at least another 45 minutes. If you cannot call w/i that time frame, I would request that you call Friday afternoon after 4pm Eastern. I will be out all day Thursday.

Contact number is what is on file, (XXX)-XXX-XXXX (USA)
Vern


[/ QUOTE ]
Dear Vern,

Thank you for contacting customer support.
We regret to inform you that your account has been closed due to a management decision and this decision is not reversible for any reason.

Regards,
Cathy


[/ QUOTE ]

Cathy,

May I ask why and may I open a new account at some time in the future?
Vern



[/ QUOTE ]

Dear Vern,

Thank you for contacting customer support.

I am very sorry, but I do not have any further information for you about the closure of your account. And, unfortunately, you will not be allowed to open another account with us.

Regards,
Cathy



[/ QUOTE ]

Cathy,

Is there a number I can call to speak with a supervisor about this. I cannot figure out what I have done to deserve banning and w/o information I am unable to offer a defense. The only thing I have done with this account in the last three weeks is change my e-mail because my old e-mail address was getting too much spam in it and my ISP was filtering outgoing mail to poker sites and preventing me from contacting them. It was shortly after I changed my e-mail that got notice to call, and I did. I was advised I would be called back but never was. When I called again 12 hours later, I was advised to send an e-mail the only response was that the account was closed. I am baffled though still hopeful this misunderstanding can be favorably resolved. Thank you for your attention to this matter.

Vern


[/ QUOTE ]


Dear Vern,

Thank you for contacting customer support.

“We want to inform you that this account has been randomly checked and found to consist with suspicious and wrongful actions that we don't support at EmpirePoker.com, due to that we regret to inform you that the account has been closed permanently by the management, the process is unfortunately not reversible, we thank you for the time you played with us.“
Please refer the Terms and conditions for more information on this
http://www.empirepoker.com/about_us/...formation.html
*17. Abandonment of Account Balance.*
The Company reserves the right to cancel your EmpirePoker.com account for any justifiable reason whatsoever at any time without notice to you. If you do not access your EmpirePoker.com account by "logging in" to your Account by using your AccountName and password for a period of one hundred and eighty (180) days, your Account will be closed and the entire Account Balance will be deemed abandoned and forfeited; provided however, such requirement for log-in and entry is not and does not constitute any requirement whatsoever for you to play any Game, deposit funds or participate in any activity at EmpirePoker.com other than logging in. For the avoidance of doubt, pursuant to this section, Company may also close any account with any ESP which you have

If you have any more concerns or suggestions please feel free to contact us.

Best regards,

Suku


[/ QUOTE ]

Suku,

I do deny you have the right to close my account at any time, but I apparently tripped over some action so heinious I get banned w/o warning. By my records my last hand was played on 4/11 and my last login was 4/27 (To change my e-mail for the previously listed reason) so account abandonment really does not apply. I have read the legel information in full and just want to know what section I transgressed so I can either refute the allegation (Even if I am wasting your time and mine) or offer some mitigating circumstance that may provide for my ban to not be permanent. According to my records, my Empire account had &lt;$1 in it so I am not really out money, I have just rather enjoyed Empire over the year as a customer, I have recommended it to others and don't want to just walk away w/o at least tryig to defend myself.

Thanks again,

Vern


[/ QUOTE ]
Dear Vern,

Thank you for your further e-mail.

We regret to inform you that your account has been closed due to a management decision and it is not reversible for any reason.

Best regards,

Louise


[/ QUOTE ]

Louise,

This disappoints me greatly. It would appear that I cannot defend myself against this misunderstanding because your rules do not permit you to inform me what rule I transgressed to be banned. I have asked for a way to contact a supervisor to try and further resolve this, but from the form of your response, that avenue appears to be closed tight.

Very well then, I apologize for whatever transgression caused this. Ignorance it not truly an excuse, but I claim it as my reason and hope some day you will reconsider at least giving me the opportunity to speak with a supervisor to try and rectify this. Thanks again.

Vern



[/ QUOTE ]
Dear Vern,

Thank you for your further e-mail.

This account has been randomly checked and found to consist with suspicious and wrongful actions that we don't support at EmpirePoker.com. Due to that we regret to inform you that the account has been closed permanently by the Management. The process is unfortunately not reversible and we thank you for the time you played with us.

For further information please refer to our terms and conditions:

http://www.empirepoker.com/about_us/...formation.html

17. Abandonment of Account Balance.
The Company reserves the right to cancel your EmpirePoker.com account for any justifiable reason whatsoever at any time without notice to you. If you do not access your EmpirePoker.com account by "logging in" to your Account by using your Account Name and password for a period of one hundred and eighty (180) days, your Account will be closed and the entire Account Balance will be deemed abandoned and forfeited; provided however, such requirement for log-in and entry is not and does not constitute any requirement whatsoever for you to play any Game, deposit funds or participate in any activity at EmpirePoker.com other than logging in. For the avoidance of doubt, pursuant to this section, Company may also close any account with any ESP which you have

Furthermore, speaking to a supervisor will not enable you to reactivate your account. As previously stated, this was a management decision and is irreversible.

Best regards,
Louise


[/ QUOTE ]
Louise,
Well after some research it would appear that my account was closed because as a player I cost you more in bonuses than I was worth in revenue. I can appreciate that position and do not have a single problem with. I do wish you had just stated that initially instead of implying I had engaged in some suspicious and wrongful acts. That was a little disturbing.

I would recommend in the future that you consider awarding your bonuses to players based upon the amount of rake they generate or insure that in complying with the terms of the bonus, it can only be completed by collecting more in rake/fess from the required play than the bonus is worth. The VIP club not withstanding, the current way you do bonuses fails to reward loyal players and allows for players to be 'in the hole' as far as revenue goes by only playing the bonuses. I am sorry that by playing the bonuses I was deemed a customer you no longer wanted. I would have appreciated a warning as I would have clearly increased my play to preserve my account.

Second, you may want to break out the first line of paragraph 17 of your T&amp;C, the one quoted by you below, into its own paragraph. When you quote the entire paragraph it appears I have been canceled because of account abandonment, when in reality only the powers invested in the first sentence apply as you have exercised your power to cancel my account for a reason you deem justifiable and have no duty to notify me of that reason.

Thank you for all your attention to this matter.

Vern




[/ QUOTE ]

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I like the layout.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Interesting.

Your e-mails were very well-written.
Empire's responses varied from evasive to non-sensical.

You are to be commended for your behaviour in this situation.


I do suggest that you continue to try to call them though.
They are clearly giving you form-responses and I doubt that your very good suggestions will be taken seriously.

Keep trying (if it's not putting you out too much) and keep us informed.

If you call back tell them that you had played there VERY recently and that you had not abandoned your account in the least.
Don't mention any bonus-whoring or anything like that.
See if they bring that up.

They are still telling you that your account was closed for 'abandonmet' type reasons so pretend like that really is their reason and point out that you haven't done that at all.

Basically, I want to see if you can get THEM to say it was just due to bonus-chasing.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I am taking this light hearted because poker is just a recreation for me. I opened an empire account because they sent me a promo offer, after I was a Party player. I signed up with my real info and same neteller as party. I will try to call them on Monday if I get no response to the last e-mail.

Vern

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I predict the response will be somewhere along the lines of:

"Robert,

We're sorry, but the first time deposit bonus is only for people making their first deposits to Empirepoker.com. You may, however, refer a friend and receive a $50 bonus! Thank you for playing at Empire Poker. Good luck at the tables!

Raghib"

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

[ QUOTE ]
my ISP was filtering outgoing mail to poker sites and preventing me from contacting them

[/ QUOTE ]
Did you make this up or is this part true? Because I've never heard of an ISP doing such a thing and I can't see why they would.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Not made up, I think some tech at the ISP tried to put pay-pro and the Party Skins in the spam list but did it backwards. Anytime I would send them an e-mail, it would bounce back from the ISP's mail server but all incoming male got through just fine. I could not get them to figure it out, so I changed to a different Pop3 capable service for my e-mail and have never had a problem with any of the accounts since.

I tried to explain the header info to a tech at the ISP, but you get what you pay for and I just want cheap broadband [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

i've had this happen several times.

first empire was filtered out (didn't even make it to my spam-box)...then a couple months later empire was fine but party was being filtered out.


this happened to paradise as well...but they were on top fo the situation.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I never got an email from Empire for whatever reason, I just started seeing these threads today and found that I couldn't log in. Now that I've read through the whole thing, I think it isn't even worth it to try to verify my information. I'm very unhappy with the way Empire has handled this, so getting my account reopened (I had maybe 17 cents in it) has almost no value to me. If they aren't even willing to give the real reasons for what's going on, I don't trust them at all. Sent the following email to see if I might hit a longshot and actually get somebody to say what they are actually doing, pasted below:



My account name is xxxxxx. I was told by one of your representatives that I needed to verify my account information to open my account. "But I've had an account for a while now" I said, "so why do I suddenly have to verify my information?" Your representative did not give a reply to this question. Eventually he told me that it was just a random check being done.

But I'm actually told that that is a bald faced lie. I'm hearing from a lot of other people that their accounts are being frozen for no reason. I'm hearing that they have to send you these verification emails, only to find that you give them bullshit responses that they have engaged in "Suspicious and wrongful" actions which you refuse to disclose. Well I can tell you this: I have never done anything either suspicious or wrongful concerning any online poker site, including yours. If what I'm told is correct, the actions taken by Empire Poker are both very suspicious and very wrongful.

In order to verify the honesty of your intentions, I therefore require that you furnish a logical, concrete reason for the freezing of my account before I provide you any more of my personal information.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Hmmm... with all this Empire collapsing talk I sure hope I still get my WSOP seat from them.
~Justin

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Well said.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

[ QUOTE ]
I predict the response will be somewhere along the lines of:

"Robert,

We're sorry, but the first time deposit bonus is only for people making their first deposits to Empirepoker.com. You may, however, refer a friend and receive a $50 bonus! Thank you for playing at Empire Poker. Good luck at the tables!

Raghib "

[/ QUOTE ]

ROFLMAO

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Robert,

Thank you for contacting customer support.

We understand your concern regarding closing of accounts.

This was a management decision made after investigating accounts that were found to practice suspicious and wrongful actions that we do not support at EmpirePoker.com

Please see our terms and conditions regarding our right to close accounts.

We have not confiscated any monies and have refunded players who write to us at vip@empirepoker.com

I have also forwarded this email to our Management team.

If you have any more concerns or suggestions please feel free to contact us.

Best regards,

Samantha
Empire Poker
Royal Flush Players Club
Customer Support Team
www.ep.com



[/ QUOTE ]


Dear Samantha (or other Empire respresentative) -

Thank you for responding in a timely fashion. It is greatly appreciated.

That's good to know that you are not confiscating any funds.

Still, I am concerned with the accounts that are being closed.
Many of the players I know have not done anything of a suspicious or wrongful nature. The only possibility here is whether Empire considers it wrongful to take advantage of the occasional reload bonuses your site offers. If this is a problem then why is your site offering the bonus in the first place?


The vagueness of the situation concerns me.
If they can have their account closed for 'wrongful activity' yet not be told what that 'wrongful activity' is then how is any player to know whether they are engaging in 'wrongful activity' at all.


Is my account there in jeopardy at all?
I don't think I have practiced any 'wrongful activity' at your site ....but neither did the players who had their accounts suddenly closed without warning.

Would it not make sense to provide some kind of warning to any player who has engaged in any kind of 'wrongful activity' so they at least can be told what they are doing wrong?

I have enjoyed playing on your site for as long as I have been a member. And I remind you that I have almost 25k in VIP points so that is evidence that I have been around for
awhile.

Can you at least provide some assurance that my account is in good standing there?
Can I also receive assurance that if somehow a problem is detected with my account that I can at least receive some sort of notice or warning about whatever those actions might be before it is suddenly closed?


Thank you

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Thanks Bob, good stuff. FWIW I sent them an email too along the same lines early this afternoon without any response, although I'm probably about 20,000 vip points shy of you.

If it comforts anyone, I was able to cash several thousand from Empire today without any shenanigans on their part, just the usual 4 hours to Neteller. No freeze on my account, but Empire is my principal outlet for play, and I've never had a month of net negative MGR from bonuses. I do however have accounts at every skin, hence my paranoia.

The really dumb thing is if this is related to having accounts at different skins, these sites never explicitly mention the names of the "shared systems." You will never see any mention of Empire on Party's site, and vice versa. Obviously any 2+2'er with half a brain knows this, but I can see how an innocent casual player can get caught up in this mess for nothing else than clicking on a banner advertising a bonus for each site.

While we're all speculating Empire is booting "whores," I think the timing with the IPO and the Pokernow fiasco is not a coincidence, and refuse to believe Empire all of a sudden had an epiphany that removing whores would be +EV for their balance sheet. This reeks of pressure from Party/IGM in my opinion.

Hopefully this blows over; good luck to all those affected.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

I should add that my concerns regarding the safety of my money that I articulate in my e-mail are pretty gosh-darned exaggerated.
I'm not really that concerned but I would appreciate it if they would respond to me and those affected more directly on this matter.


I deposited my $1k a couple nights ago to receive my monthly $100 bonus (at 15k points you get a monthly bonus with no play-through requirement). The $100 bonus was transferred into my account today.


Empire is hardly going under. It's obvious that this just bad management and procedure and they attempt to clean-out the bonus-whores.
The sky is not falling and i don't believe my money at empire is in any jeopardy.

But they are accountable and I agree with William and Vern that accusing a whole lot of players of participating in 'wrongful or suspicious' activity when they really haven't done anything wrong is in especially bad form.


Online casinos when giving bonus-abusers the boot have no problem telling the bonus-chaser that they simply no longer desire their business because they are supposedly 'abusing' their bonus policy.
I find no reason why Empire needs to pretend like it's something else.


Furthermore...they need to realize that if others who have done nothing wrong can have their accounts closed then this creates confusion among the other players who are left wondering what exactly the rules are. Is there something I should be doing to keep my account from being closed?


Their intentional vagueness CAN be interpreted to mean that empire can and will just accuse whoever they like of 'wrongful activity' without bothering to tell anyone what that even means.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

did they bump you up for the Royal Flush Club liek they do for VIP? or do you actually have to earn the 15k points (i mean how when you hit like 1000 points they automatically make you a VIP. do they do this at 12k or something for the Royal Flush Club?)

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

[ QUOTE ]
Dear Robert,
Thank you for contacting customer support.

I can assure you that you account is of good standing with us as are the majority of our players and we have no intention of closing your account.

The decision to close without notice was made by our management as is their right as per the terms and conditions.

If you have any more concerns or suggestions please feel free to contact us.

Best regards,

Samantha
Empire Poker
Royal Flush Players Club
Customer Support Team
www.ep.com



[/ QUOTE ]



The part about this that disturbs me is this whole 'as per their right' crap.
Well....how exactly am I to know that they won't just decide to indiscriminantly exercise this 'right' on my account?


I'm done writing to them for now. The fact they actually responded to me is more than I expected.


Their vagueness really does bother me and we'll see what kind of mood I am in about playing there after I get my TV in the mail.


The fact that I also get the free $100 bonus each month (royal flush club member) for doing practically nothing means I'll probably be sticking around.

But I'll be keeping less on balance there for certain.


Again - I have no real concerns about my money there or about my account being closed. I play there fairly regularly obviously.
But I do go from being 99.98% confident in my monies and account there to perhaps 99.90% confident.

Meaning that I'm not THAT concerned about it...but their lack of professionalism in this matter does need to be considered.

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

They have stopped answering my e-mails, I may or may not try to call support. One of my concerns is that I can still get into other skins to play in those pools, which I fear would be jeapordized by calling the support line and jumping up and down. The latter may be satisfying, but may be -EV if they booted me from all skins as a result.

Vern

Re: My long-winded e-mail to Empire
 

Bob, can I ask why you are doing this? It seems to me, you play there a lot and are a valued customer to them. I don't see why you are trying to defend the people that are only are playing there for bonuses. I don't understand why you would try to use your good standing in Empire to try to help out people who aren't benefitting you or Empire.