Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

Villian is a loose (85% of hands) POS. Could play anything. Anything at all. Even 2 suited low cards...

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP3 calls, Hero calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, BB checks.

Flop: (5.50 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB folds, <font color="#CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 caps</font>, Hero calls, UTG calls, MP1 calls.

Turn: (10.75 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
UTG checks, MP1 checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP3 bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

River: (18.75 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, MP1 folds, MP3 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, MP3 folds, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 25.75 BB

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

id just call river i think. too many ways to be beaten...chance of a reraise seems high with that board.

but if you think he would reraise or bet with a really terrible hand then by all means, smack him back.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

Just call the river (and the turn for that matter). This is spewing in a large way.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

[ QUOTE ]
Villian is a loose (85% of hands) POS. Could play anything. Anything at all. Even 2 suited low cards...

[/ QUOTE ]
I wonder if he had two [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]s?? That's just a guess, you know. If so, he played his hand way better than you played yours.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

Ignore the flush, any king gives the villians this hand.

Just call the river.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

Your 2 pair is crappy on the river, as anybody with a K makes a straight, and theres also a 3 flush.

Call -- raising is chip spewing.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

There is also 4 to a straight on board. How about just overcalling the river?

Edit: Perhaps I shouldn't bother grunching obvious answers when it's obvious others have already answered the same answer. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

does anybody else hate this turn raise as much as me, vs. the non-maniac?

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

[ QUOTE ]
does anybody else hate this turn raise as much as me, vs. the non-maniac?

[/ QUOTE ]

Probably not as much as you, as I used to be guilty of being too aggressive on the turn myself. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

I do dislike it, though.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
does anybody else hate this turn raise as much as me, vs. the non-maniac?

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Probably not as much as you

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This made me laugh.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

I've made this mistake a few times. I improve on the river or turn, but I act before I realize that the card completes several draws. Slow down.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
does anybody else hate this turn raise as much as me, vs. the non-maniac?

[/ QUOTE ]

Probably not as much as you...



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What good thing can you say about the turn raise? Are we value raising with the best hand? Are we protecting our hand from draws?

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

Well, the nice thing we can say about the turn and river raises is that they can be used as tax write-offs due to charity donations. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

[ QUOTE ]
Well, the nice thing we can say about the turn and river raises is that they can be used as tax write-offs due to charity donations. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

pwned...

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Well, the nice thing we can say about the turn and river raises is that they can be used as tax write-offs due to charity donations. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

pwned...

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]

This made me laugh.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

Forget the turn raise, I'm wondering about even calling the turn. We hold second pair, OK kicker. We're up against a villain who's a lock to hang onto and call down with Ax. Two pair for us means a straight to anyone holding a King and maybe a flush. I think we're behind most of the time with 2 outs for the queens. How 'bout a fold?

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think we're behind most of the time with 2 outs for the queens. How 'bout a fold?

[/ QUOTE ]

What wbout the K's? We can't fold it here.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

first: i would raise preflop.
second: i think i dislike the flop raise - but i could be biased by the subsequent action. i have mediocre to strong negative feelings about calling 2 more on the flop when it comes back to you capped.
third: i hate the turn raise
fourth: i hate the river raise even more.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

I really doubt I'd raise the turn here.

I would probably fold the river, rather than raise. Especially after UTG wakes up for the first time all hand and already has a caller, there is a 3-flush and four to broadway, you have a weak 2 pair. I would have certainly folded to the 3-bet.

If four people see the river and you have four to broadway with only the king missing, you're a dead dude.

UTG either has a flush or a king, and you most likely have the third best hand here.

There is a three flush

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

Why the hell do you raise the river with a flushdraw completing and a 4straight on board?

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

--- Grunching (Now that I know what that means!) ---

I would be a little nervous about MP3. Smooth-calling then capping the flop, then waking up on the turn. Your raise slowed him down though, but I think he could very possibly hold AQ or AJ and be afraid of a set or straight at the turn. I like the aggression on your part through the turn, but not only does the river bring a 3rd spade (which doesn't scare me too much), but it makes a lone K a winner vs your 2 pr. Exactly the kind of hand that a loose POS will hang on to ("Hey, I've got an overcard to the flop, picked up a gutshot on the turn..." and of course the miracle occurs.). No way you can fold the river, but a raise seems a little optimistic, especially when you can close the action.

Re: Oh No...how to play with river flush draw
 

MP3 calls/caps the flop and then leads the turn without being scared of the A. I don't think your Q is good on the turn. But I'd just call since you have a nice draw to the nuts plus a couple of outs for Q and T.