UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

Okay, you've got the rockets and are first to act. Now, if you open/raise, you will get 5-7 callers (11 man game) 90% of the time. If you limp, you will get the same, with one of the early players raising. You cannot expect a re-raise if you open/raise, because there is no such thing as "isolating" unless they have really bad hands. I mean the SB will call 2 with 32 suited.
Do you open/raise, limp/call or limp/re-raise?

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

open raise

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

raise, and start to build a big pot. Get ready to checkrasie the turn, or do some funky stuff to clear some people out of the big pot. Gotta do what you can to win it when the pot is big.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

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If you limp, you will get the same, with one of the early players raising.

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If I have AA UTG and am 90 percent sure there will be an open-raiser if I limp, but not a re-raiser if I raise, then I will limp-reraise 100 % of the time and I don't care how many callers there are. Capiche?

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

Capiche..........that's what I've been doing...alot of ups and downs in this game though..........

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

But if you think that you will get the same number of callers with an open raise, the decision to limp shouldn't matter, right?

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

except that limp/reraise gets 3 bets in when your equity is better than anyone elses.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

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But if you think that you will get the same number of callers with an open raise, the decision to limp shouldn't matter, right?

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Sure it should - you should limp-reraise to get more money in. He said if he raises, no one will 3-bet. So he's got 6 opponents for 14sb. If he only limps, someone will raise and he can reraise; so he's got 6 opponents for 21sb.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

The main justifications for open-raising with AA is to get in more bets preflop or to limit the field (the former may or may not happen, the latter is just wrong).

If you know you can get in more bets preflop AND it doesn't change the size of the field, what's not to like?

Failing to limp-reraise in this situation would be one of the worst mistakes in the history of poker.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

Use whatever strategy will get the most money in the pot. You have the best possible hand. If you are sure there will be multiple callers and a raiser, this is a no brainer limp-reraise. So what if the pot will be swollen to the point where everyone will chase. Simple equity situation...win less often but bigger pots.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

Given your description of the action, which is highly unlikely to actually be true in any real game scenario, you should definitely open limp. To open raise in the situation described is very bad.

The advantage to open-raising is that it isn't so obvious that you have a hand like AA, but giving up this information is worth less than the five to seven extra small bets you're getting in the pot right away.

Of course, I simply don't believe your conditions. Usually, the decision is closer than you make it.

-Michael

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

[ QUOTE ]
Capiche..........that's what I've been doing...alot of ups and downs in this game though..........

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Pocket AA or KK is the monster hand to have either in loose/tight/passive/aggressive/wild/weak/soft/crazy and whatever kind of game you can think of. They work well one on one of course. But they also work very well multi-way. You have the best starting hand and thus you to maximize value for it. So that is why pre-flop you always raise and re-raise no matter what. So if I know there's going to be a raiser up front, then I'll limp and re-pop it. It's great +EV.

Sure enough, multi-way the chances for your Aces to win go down, but usually if you do win, you'll be compsensated by a bigger pot or more BB won. This offsets the times you do lose. Again it's all about EV, and not how many times you win or lose.

Many players whine they never win with AA in multi-way which is downright a lie. I've taken some 25+ BB pots down with AA in EP with about 6 - 8 callers unimproved on the board. At the same time, expect to be outdrawn your fair share. It's the nature of loose games.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

[ QUOTE ]
Sure it should - you should limp-reraise to get more money in. He said if he raises, no one will 3-bet. So he's got 6 opponents for 14sb. If he only limps, someone will raise and he can reraise; so he's got 6 opponents for 21sb.

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Or you could get 8 opponents for 8 SB. I'd open raise

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

Why on earth would you want that. IF you don't want to get a lot of money in the pot with AA, when do you want to get a lot of money in the pot. The post flop action won't change, as this lineup obviously doesn't pay attention to pot odds and other concepts, which means your Aces are either going to win, or not...might as well take the 7:1 preflop for the max possible, dontcha think...

Backraise
 

If you are really that confident that there will be a raise if you limp, then I'd play for a back-raise. Your hand is so much stronger than any other that you get a ton of pre-flop equity. Make the others commit as much to the pot as possible when they are way behind, and you amplify their error. Fundamental TOP.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

I've seen 10/20's like this. In fact, I've played in a 10/20 in which at least three consecutive hands were capped (5 bets) pre-flop, at least 7-way action.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

I'm not saying that these games don't exist, but that the OP's set of conditions was unreasonable. Even in insane games, UTG raises are going to get some respect from some players. And to say that there will be a guaranteed raise behind is outrageous.

-Michael

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

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Why on earth would you want that.

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He agrees with you. He wasn't saying that that's a favorable outcome; he was saying that it is a danger. That's why he said he would raise.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

If you really think someone will raise behind you, go for the limp reraise. If in doubt, raise it. You're not trying to isolate with this hand. You shouldn't mind 7 callers to your raise here. But i do know the feeling of watching your likelihood of it holding up going down.

I tried a limp reraise last night. 2 maniacs on my left. They both just LIMPED behind me!!! I guess they didn't have their normal J6o to raise with. Turns out one of them had KJo. Them's the breaks though.

b

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

What is this happy days? Tell me something I don't know.

Re: UTG with AA in very loose 10/20
 

[ QUOTE ]
What is this happy days? Tell me something I don't know.

[/ QUOTE ]

That I forgot to give your girlfriend her bra back last night?