Downswing
 

I've been playing 1/2 limit on Poker stars lately and I just lost about 40 bucks in maybe an hour. Is this a normal downswing, should I expect this to happen or am I playing bad? I don't feel to bad about it as I lost most of it on good hands that got beat. Looking back I could of shaved of a few losses, I got in a raising war on the flop with KK against somebody who tripped his 44. I called him all the way down and lost two bets when I should of known I was beat. My other main losses were on QQ and 77, it just seemed like everytime I got a good hand it got beat on the flop. Much of it was lost on hands I raised pre-flop but had to fold after.

I just need somebody to tell me this is a normal downswing so I can get my confidence back. I just moved up from .50/1 and losing 40 bucks so quickly makes me think I should go back down.

Re: Downswing
 

I lost $40 today in one minute and 57 seconds.
Good thing I am adequately bankrolled.
Are you?

Re: Downswing
 

With the new sheriff patrolling these parts, I'm putting the over-under at when this post gets locked at 20 minutes. Anybody want some of this action?

(And before it does -- yes, a 20BB downswing in one hour is totally normal. Did you ever lose $20 in a session at .5/1?)

Re: Downswing
 

Well, when you have KK and someone flops a small set, you are going to lose a lot of money. Recall in the books where they say you want to be up against AA/KK when your small pp hits a set on the flop? Well, it runs both ways.

Now, as for letting it go on the later streets, I would have to know more about the action and your reads on the opponent. I think it is common to call down as generally the pot is too big to fold, but it really depends.

As for losing 20 BB in an hour? I think we've all done that before. When I get a string of strong flush draws that don't come in I can lose a lot of money in some really big pots. As long as I'm playing those draws properly I'm not terribly concerned. Though I prefer the dead card periods to not give me anything at all rather than expensive non-winning hands.

Re: Downswing
 

[ QUOTE ]
With the new sheriff patrolling these parts, I'm putting the over-under at when this post gets locked at 20 minutes. Anybody want some of this action?

(And before it does -- yes, a 20BB downswing in one hour is totally normal. Did you ever lose $20 in a session at .5/1?)

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll take the over for a dollar...Wook won't even be awake for another 45 minutes.

Re: Downswing
 

SIIHP

Re: Downswing
 

A 20BB downswing is completely normal. Even 200BB downswings can be normal. Make sure you are properly bankrolled (300BB) for your limit.

Re: Downswing
 

Did I play these hands correct?

PokerStars 1/2 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls, MP2 calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, MP2 folds, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 3.75 BB

PokerStars 1/2 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">6 folds</font>, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (5.50 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 bets</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 3.25 BB

Re: Downswing
 

Get dealt KK vs AA three times within an hour and both flop sets, and see if you are playing badly or it's just normal. Anything can happen in the short term.

Re: Downswing
 

I would say raising that second hand pre-flop is too aggressive. I may raise the first one on the flop, but I'd fold the second one.

Re: Downswing
 

[ QUOTE ]
Did I play these hands correct?

[/ QUOTE ]
Sure looks like it.

EDIT: Wow -- 13 minutes. I might owe boz a buck...

Re: Downswing
 

Yeah, I think I am playing the mid pockets a little to aggressive. I look at my stats and those hands are some of my top losers.

Re: Downswing
 

[ QUOTE ]
A 20BB downswing is completely normal. Even 200BB downswings can be normal.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's what I needed to hear.

Re: Downswing
 

I've had a 40BB loss within 40 minutes. Your 20BB loss in an hour is no big deal, this will happen all the time.

Re: Downswing
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, I think I am playing the mid pockets a little to aggressive. I look at my stats and those hands are some of my top losers.

[/ QUOTE ]

While this is possible, be wary of your sample size. Individual hand stats mean nothing until you have a huge number of hands.

Re: Downswing
 

29 minutes and counting! Yay, me!

Re: Downswing
 

I'd be so bold as to say, if you're not having swings of more than 20BB, then you're not being aggressive enough with your good draws and your hands that need protection. Since reading Ed Miller's ideas, my swings have become more exaggerated since I'm juicing the pot more than I used to in my tight/passive days.

Re: Downswing
 

1/2 meaning $40 translates to 20 BB (big bets)


TOTALLY, 100% COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT IN THE LONG TERM.

This isn't a downswing, this isn't even a bad session, this is like 3 bad hands.

If you want to play poker seriously, or hell even for fun then you have to expect that even with near PERFECT play (which I'm assuming you are no where near to, no offense but just honesty) that you will have swings in excess of 100, 150, 200+ BB in your poker life. They will be semi-rare but they WILL happen.

My KK is at about 36% win rate over hte last 40 or so times I've gotten it, and I'm down slightly with it

But my QQ is hot as fire over the last 40, winning like 70% and I'm up huge with it.

Strange stuff happens short term.

Re: Downswing
 

Damn, you win. Our sheriff has abandoned us -- the law is dead.

I'll pay you in the form of donking an extra buck your way at the next 2+2 table. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Downswing
 

You're fine Slim. Just keep playing good cards and play them well. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

I lost 75BB tonight in about 2 hours (some of this was due to a small tilt session at the end, but even before that I was down 60'ish). Every once in a while you have "That F***ing Night". The night in which some or all of the following happen:

1) Every time you flop TPTK with your AK or AQ someone with A8- pairs their kicker on the turn or river.

2) Every flush and OES draw miss, but not before you call multiple raises in gigantic multi-way pots.

3) Every large pocket pair gets cracked by small connectors or small pocket pairs.

4) Every small pocket pair misses, except one....and when you hit that set it gets flushed out.

ETC.

When this happens I usually go to Poker Tracker and replay my hands to see how much of my losses were in fact bad luck, and how much of my losses were poor play.

Good luck to you!

Re: Downswing
 

no its not normal i'd move up in limits to play people who respect your raises and who wont draw out on you because they will know they are beaten.

Re: Downswing
 

[ QUOTE ]
no its not normal i'd move up in limits to play people who respect your raises and who wont draw out on you because they will know they are beaten.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
branden
journeyman


Reged: 07/27/05
Posts: 56
Loc: albuquerque, NM

[/ QUOTE ]

I love it when the newbies start crackin' wise!

Re: Downswing
 

Just remember these times when that insane win rush hits you and you suddenly think "I must be a poker god!'

In ancient Rome, when a conquering general was feted by a parade in his honor, a slave would hold a laurel wreath over his head and whisper in his ear "Remember, thou art only human."

We don't have slaves. We have downswings.

I wish I had that link to Homer's great post on swings. It really puts them into perspective if you see the veeeerrrrrry long term.

Re: Downswing
 

I think you mean this one

Re: Downswing
 

A 20bb downswing is nothing. You can't win every time you play.

Re: Downswing
 

[ QUOTE ]
With the new sheriff patrolling these parts, I'm putting the over-under at when this post gets locked at 20 minutes. Anybody want some of this action?

(And before it does -- yes, a 20BB downswing in one hour is totally normal. Did you ever lose $20 in a session at .5/1?)

[/ QUOTE ]

1 hour, 40 min. I was in a lab meeting.