Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

I love it how the 2+2 masses did everything they could to force out Annie Duke, who did nothing but come here with a positive, respectful attitude and now they are sucking off Paul Phillips, whose superb strategy posts would be worth giving up if he would just die already.

-Michael

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

[ QUOTE ]
I love it how the 2+2 masses did everything they could to force out Annie Duke, who did nothing but come here with a positive, respectful attitude and now they are sucking off Paul Phillips, whose superb strategy posts would be worth giving up if he would just die already.

[/ QUOTE ]

You shoudn't have to kill me to get me to leave. If a public opinion poll were to show people wanted me to stop posting, I'd be straight out the door and cut the rope bridge back.

I'd be curious to see how you would word such a poll and whether you would believe the results. No matter though, I'll gladly place my fate in your hands and trust you to handle the implementation details.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

A public opinion would surely favor you. If I were wording said survey, I would include different categories for you and your ego, with the hope that one and not the other could be expelled before it engulfs the board.

-Michael

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

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I love it how the 2+2 masses

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Don't be stupid.

You know quite well that there were plenty of people who greeted Annie in a warm, welcoming manner and were enthusiastic about hearing from her. You also know that there are plenty of people who have a hard-on for bashing Paul (obviously you're one of them).

I don't see much difference in how either one of them were treated. Posters reacted how they reacted to each one, some favorably and some not. There were certainly no "2+2 masses" at work.

There are people who rag on both, some that rag on one or the other, and others who like both -- and all sorts of shades in between.

That is all; resume your petty crap.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

[ QUOTE ]
A public opinion would surely favor you. If I were wording said survey, I would include different categories for you and your ego, with the hope that one and not the other could be expelled before it engulfs the board.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is some seriously cool language right there. I feel like I'm living in a comic. "Superfriends! We must stop it, before it engulfs the board! Aquaman: go do your regular flailing in the water. UsefulMan: try to reason with him. And the rest of us will start arming the nukes."

If you can get part of me voted out in a fairish poll (that is, one I wouldn't look at and say "oh, please") I'd see if I could write what you want without what you don't want. Some combinations of features may not be possible on this unit. Unit may react unpredictably to missing features. Manufacturer's warranty is void on opened units.

See, look how flexible I am.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

"'That is some seriously cool language right there. I feel like I'm living in a comic. 'Superfriends! We must stop it, before it engulfs the board!' Aquaman: go do your regular flailing in the water. UsefulMan: try to reason with him. And the rest of us will start arming the nukes.'"

Write up my response where I beat this.

-Michael

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

I'd just like to know what Paul did to those people who seem to really dislike him on an intense level.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

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I'd just like to know what Paul did to those people who seem to really dislike him on an intense level.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think he raped somebody.

Or maybe he was raped. It's all just so damn confusing. Some people are even saying he looks like that transvestite Jeff Shulman. Others are saying he is Jeff Shulman and that a recent stretch in prison (for rape) turned him into a girl. But me? I wouldn't know.

I, Legian, (also a newbie here) could throw out some ideas on how to make money at poker and those ideas would either be repeats of what you've already read or they would be just plain wrong. I doubt anybody would read them anyway which is just as well because who the hell wants to give money-making tips away?

Well, maybe some of the top tournament pros give away advice too so isn't it worthwhile having such people here, spreading egos and seed and enlightenment with each sweet-smelling breath they emit?

It's only poker and the internet. F**k the poll.

Legian

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

It's interesting that you mention two people. One is a lot more famous than the other, but on here that one is a lot more polite and humble than the other, too. Yet that one got treated a lot worse.

That's a shame.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

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I love it how the 2+2 masses did everything they could to force out Annie Duke


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What's your sample size for the term "masses" -- anything less than 1,000,000 hands can't really be considered.

Allowing for those limitations, I don't think many people here on 2+2 treated Annie poorly -- there are hundreds and hundreds of people on this board(thousands!) and while some did act completely out of line ... such is to be expected.

There must be some type of insane validation one gets from mocking famous people (even if said mockery is wholly undeserved). I would place far better than 3:1 odds that none of these people, if they were to meet Annie face to face, or to meet Paul face to face, would spew any venom whatsoever.

The Internet makes even the meekest brave.

Fun non-poker story: I design the WWE collectible card game and a few years back there was a huge online feud going on between a few players. They were all set to be at the same convention. Many thought that it would turn into fisticuffs once the parties were brought together, that's how heated the exchanges were. What actually happened...? The people in question just avoided each other - not a negative word was said.

In short: it's how the Internet functions. There is a line from Jay & Silent Bob Strike Back where Ben "The Bomb in Phantoms" Affleck remarks to the duo that the Internet is a device for porn and bashing famous people. Sadly, it's too true.


Barron Vangor Toth
www.BarronVangorToth.com

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

If you think Annie Duke got a hard time you should have seen the chat at VC in the lobby when Doyle Brunson came into the chat to answer questions.

Its the internet it is full of haters I am sure most people would say nothing in real life but would probably be bragging to thier buddies who they had met.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

Michael, I was thinking the exact same thing recently.

Here's an exchange I see myself having with someone in the future with someone:

Me: Ya, I read the 2+2 poker forums quite often.
Someone:Oh ya, do any poker celebrities post on there.
Me:Sure, Greenstein, Annie Duke, Paul Phillips, Greg Raymer..
Someone: Really? That sounds cool. What do they have to say.
Me: Well Raymer I know used to give a lot of sound strategy advice, but I'm not sure if he still does. Greensteins not around too often, and Annie Duke comes around and chats about tourney's she's played in and stuff. Annie's pretty cool, cause when she first came here, she took a lot of crap about stuff Daniel N. said about her. But,Annie weathered the storm like a champ and now I think most people REALLY like having her around. I think she feels pretty welcome and stuff.

Someone: What about Paul Phillips?

Me: Yuck. He says he really isn't interested in talking strategy at all. He likes to get into verbal sparring sessions over minute logical details. Its really petty and makes it seem as if he never grew up. You know, I think that's what it is... He never had to grow. He earned a lot of money at a young age, and it seems he thinks his **** doesn't stink. Oh well. Funny thing is, someone challenged him to a game of Scrabble, and he backed down. The reason why its comical is cause Paul was talking about how he'd mop the floor with that person. He made up a bunch of excuses about how he thought the other person would cheat. Then, he went on to belittle the woman's intelligence.. It was really wierd. When Paul came on here, everyone was psyched to have him here... Now, I think a lot of us would wish he goes away.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

if you dont like his posts dont read them. there are plenty of people who think he is smart and funny

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

If imparting poker knowledge with an overhealthy dose of ego qualifies one for the 2+2 death penalty, I wonder who is going to break the news to Sklansky.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

[ QUOTE ]



Someone: What about Paul Phillips?

Me: Yuck. He says he really isn't interested in talking strategy at all. He likes to get into verbal sparring sessions over minute logical details. Its really petty and makes it seem as if he never grew up. You know, I think that's what it is... He never had to grow. He earned a lot of money at a young age, and it seems he thinks his **** doesn't stink. Oh well. Funny thing is, someone challenged him to a game of Scrabble, and he backed down. The reason why its comical is cause Paul was talking about how he'd mop the floor with that person. He made up a bunch of excuses about how he thought the other person would cheat. Then, he went on to belittle the woman's intelligence.. It was really wierd. When Paul came on here, everyone was psyched to have him here... Now, I think a lot of us would wish he goes away.

[/ QUOTE ]


I'm amazed at how the actual facts (which are right there, waiting for anyone to read) can get twisted around by those with agendas of the aforementioned bend towards random insults and innuendo vs. anything substantial and applicable. NOW we're going to make fun of the guy because he's not only a pro poker player on TV but also because he was fortunate enough to make a lot of money...? Can we find anything else petty to be jealous about?

Or perhaps we'll just let envy and lies become the good story to take the place of the actual truth.

Barron Vangor Toth
www.BarronVangorToth.com

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

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I wonder who is going to break the news to Sklansky.

[/ QUOTE ]
I nominate Annie Duke.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

you need to pay a bit closer attention when you read some of these threads... there is some interesting stuff to be gained from them, and if the most important thing you are taking from them is that Paul is a dick, you are missing something...

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

Please stick around Paul, the boards here are too short of witty intelligent responses as it is now. I suspect you will since all the crap you get here still won't compare to RGP.

Besides anyone willing to take Chris Brown to task is OK in my book.


Jimbo

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

The hard part is in figuring out what we have to write to get her back!

WOW
 

We really are becoming more like RGP

Way to go, guys.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

[ QUOTE ]
If imparting poker knowledge with an overhealthy dose of ego qualifies one for the 2+2 death penalty, I wonder who is going to break the news to Sklansky.

[/ QUOTE ]

Or El Diablo, astroglide, Joe Tall...

Paul's tone fits right in with a lot of established posters. (and mind you, I think that's a good thing. A sense of humor is fun) As does his apparent intelligence and ability.

More Paul, less people who can't take a joke.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

[ QUOTE ]
I love it how the 2+2 masses did everything they could to force out Annie Duke, who did nothing but come here with a positive, respectful attitude and now they are sucking off Paul Phillips, whose superb strategy posts would be worth giving up if he would just die already.

-Michael

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure that I saw a lot of difference between posters' treatment of Annie and Paul. Most people here were welcomed both for what they could contribute. A small minority, as in any group of people, felt it necessary to build up their own fragile egos by tearing down their betters, and to get their cheap thrills by repeating inane, irrelevant gossip.

Annie appeared to come here to provide information. Paul went a step further and engaged in some give and take on appropriate non-strategy forums. I found his verbal sparring to have some wit and intelligence. Many here found it to be egotistic and condescending. To those, I say, get a sense of humor. To those whose mission in life seems to be to tear down anyone who rises above their own mediocre level, I say get a life.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

Seems a lot of people here are jealous of Paul. Who doesn't want to be young, good looking, rich, and have the ability to spell words longer than six letters in length correctly?

However, I am three out of four of those things. I also have friends who are four out of four of those things, so I don't feel threatened by his presense. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

I've got the poll all lined up...I'll post it now.

RB

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

Hey Paul:

If I were you I would look to the old Chinese saying "Dogs may bark but heaven could care less!"

Why waste time by responding to incendiary posts like the one that started this thread? I suggest you take the high road and don't waste time with these rat droppings you come across every now and then. For one I find your posts insightful and entertaining and if you have happened to flaunt your ego in them (which I personally could not detect) I say "You well deserve it!" There was one more moron not long back who made a personal attack on Greg Reymer and even made insulting reference to his wife! Greg got all riled up over that post when he should have just laughed it off and continued on his way.

This is a free country; this is an open forum; and as you would expect you find the best of the best and worst of the worst.

That's all.

Neal

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

FWIW, Annie posted a couple of weeks ago, and I didn't see any indication that she was quitting the forum.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

granted i'm nobody, but i'd like to see both stay. Although it is confusing when Paul lapses straight into algabreic mumbo jumbo.

Paul,
One hand i saw you play on tv i think you said something to the effect that the pot was laying you way too many odds and you had an enormous amount of outs. I wish i could remember, i'd love to hear they laymans version of that, supported by the math.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

Before you solicit a response to your question it would help if you clarify which pot you are talking about?

The one your smoke or the one Paul talks about when he is posting poker talk?

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why waste time by responding to incendiary posts like the one that started this thread?

[/ QUOTE ]

Check your premises. If it amuses me to reply then it's only time wasted by your measure, not by mine.

[ QUOTE ]
I suggest you take the high road

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There are a lot of roads. I think life would be a lot less interesting if everyone walked the road I think you're implying (the road where I'm much more selective about what I answer.) As well, I'm pretty sure there are a lot of lower roads than this one. My responses are civilized, anyway.

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For one I find your posts insightful and entertaining and if you have happened to flaunt your ego in them (which I personally could not detect)

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Thanks. That's part of the fascination of all this. Two reasonably intelligent people read a few of my posts: one develops a seething contempt while the other is only entertained. One pulls out his thesaurus so he can list all the synonyms for "egomaniac" in his vituperative response, and the other says he couldn't even detect it. Why do people tick so differently? I don't know either but if you can figure it out you'll probably do well at poker.

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

First, I do not usually posts about things where I feel it is really just people trying to rag on a certain guy but I was intrigued by Paul's response.

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Why do people tick so differently? I don't know either but if you can figure it out you'll probably do well at poker.

[/ QUOTE ]
This, IMHO, is an incredibly insightful comment and I couldn't agree more. I am also intrigued by the fact that many younger poker players also seem to be computer programmers (myself included). The mindset of a programmer I think really does lend itself to poker as well (and I know there have been other posts stating this with much more reasoning behing it).

Anyway, I have always found your posts very interesting, intriguing, and challenging. Sometimes you really make me wonder what odds what be in certain situations and how I would go about calculating that. Maybe partly that shows my statistical weakness (I have always loved math but have never considered myself a stats wiz) but I think many of the challenges/questions you pose would indeed be challenging for most.

I for one think the more posts from people who are professional poker players can only help and should be welcomed. And I think it would stupid for anyone to argue that Annie, Paul, Barry, Greg, etc. are not professionals.

Will

Re: Annie Duke and Paul Phillips
 

I wanted this thread to pass by, but since it has been bumped to the top again, I will retract my original statement and proclaim that I was wrong, with apologies to Paul.

-Michael

Ahem
 

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More Paul, less people who can't take a joke.

[/ QUOTE ]

Freudian slip perhaps?