How would YOU! play this hand:
 

You were not the preflop aggressor.
http://www.ribbo.com/nuts.jpg

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

Yikes...right now I would be afraid of pocket Kings....yes nice royal flush draw with nut straight...not sure what I'll do....so what did you do?

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

I call any bet ahead of me and put a standard half pot bet if it is checked to me. (which I do alot), and there's a good chance everyone folds, but I can live with that. If I'm lucky, someone else made the straight, and I pot him the rest of the way.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

Open fold. It can only get you into trouble.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

It got checked to me and I led out a $6 bet into a $24 pot that got 1 caller. Clearly checking the flop should not be an option right?

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yikes...right now I would be afraid of pocket Kings....yes nice royal flush draw with nut straight...not sure what I'll do....so what did you do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Why would you be afraid of pocket kings with you holding pocket jacks? He only has 3 outs on the flop. The ten of spades and the case jack is no good.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

I'd prefer the 1/2 pot or less bet unless you feel pretty sure the guy behind you will bet. I think you want any drawers to think they have odds, and you want money in the pot. And you want to give a made straight who may have checked in front of you a chance to re-raise.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

that hand is sex.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

I would pot it. The only way you're going to get action on this hand is if someone else has broadway also, and if they do, then you may as well get your freerolled pot charged up.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

[ QUOTE ]
I would pot it. The only way you're going to get action on this hand is if someone else has broadway also, and if they do, then you may as well get your freerolled pot charged up.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree. If someone has the nut straight on the flop, a small bet will get them to play back at you, you can at this point shove back. If however they have some marginal holding, then a small bet of around 25% of the pot will get them to doubt your holding.
http://www.pokerhand.org/index.php?p...mp;hand=112958
This is how I played the hand through in the end. Remember that I bet big a lot of times, so when I bet small it looks like i'm either uncertain about my hand to someone, or I really want them to call.
As I have pointed out in previous posts, if they don't call because you bet too much, then you've lost money. What I did particularily with the hand is make my holding look like a steal on the river. It's often important to think about what your bet looks like to another person. If the situation was reversed, what would you think about someone betting $6 into a $24 pot on the flop, then $6 again when a flush hits and the pot is $36.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

I would grab the screenshot and then post it on the internet because it's sooooo pretty.

Better enjoy while you can guys because I don't think the moderator allows porn on this forum.

James

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

I would probably put in a small bet when it is checked around to me to see if I get more than one caller, but I would seriously consider checking it through. Somehow I need to get all my money in here and just pray that the flush draw brings some donk along with a flush draw and two pair....anything.

The only way I can see this being a big pot is if you get another straight to come along, then hit your flush.

Dave

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

I would say you played that as well as it could be played, and got the maximum you were going to get. Unlucky that nobody else flopped the straight.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I would pot it. The only way you're going to get action on this hand is if someone else has broadway also, and if they do, then you may as well get your freerolled pot charged up.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree. If someone has the nut straight on the flop, a small bet will get them to play back at you, you can at this point shove back. If however they have some marginal holding, then a small bet of around 25% of the pot will get them to doubt your holding.
http://www.pokerhand.org/index.php?p...mp;hand=112958
This is how I played the hand through in the end. Remember that I bet big a lot of times, so when I bet small it looks like i'm either uncertain about my hand to someone, or I really want them to call.
As I have pointed out in previous posts, if they don't call because you bet too much, then you've lost money. What I did particularily with the hand is make my holding look like a steal on the river. It's often important to think about what your bet looks like to another person. If the situation was reversed, what would you think about someone betting $6 into a $24 pot on the flop, then $6 again when a flush hits and the pot is $36.

[/ QUOTE ]

All I have to say is rackmstackem is now on my buddy list. A naked queen with a 5-high flush draw? Yikes.

Brad

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

Since there were only 4 players in the pot, a small bet looking like a steal made sense. In general, your only options were to make a small bet or pot it (checking is bad). It all boils down to your current image, your feel about your opponents, and how do you want to utilize your image in the future based on the current play.

Edited;
I don't think you will get any action potting it since studd7card is a smart player. He's not the chasing player. A steal-look-alike flop bet is a better option and you hope that someone else had the straight or some sort of draws so everyone would call based on the reasons of schooling and suspicion.

JMO.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

How to optimally nut-peddle has virtually nothing to do with general strategy, and virtually everything to do with table image, opponents' tendencies, and the like.

A truly weak player may interpret a flop underbet as a sign of weakness from someone who is frequently potting on the flop (and obviously, your opponent here was a truly weak opponent), but a strong player probably would not. Against this opponent, then, it was a good move, but it might not be the best move against someone else.

Also, I don't think your argument for betting small so another broadway will play back at you necessarily holds water... broadway will play back at you no matter what you bet if that's what is out there, unless the opponent is very strong. Therefore, you might as well get as much money in before your freeroll hits, which may scare away further action.

But again, this is just semantics. What matters more than anything is who else is in the hand with you, how they will interpret your action, etc.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

[ QUOTE ]
How to optimally nut-peddle has virtually nothing to do with general strategy, and virtually everything to do with table image, opponents' tendencies, and the like.

A truly weak player may interpret a flop underbet as a sign of weakness from someone who is frequently potting on the flop (and obviously, your opponent here was a truly weak opponent), but a strong player probably would not. Against this opponent, then, it was a good move, but it might not be the best move against someone else.

Also, I don't think your argument for betting small so another broadway will play back at you necessarily holds water... broadway will play back at you no matter what you bet if that's what is out there, unless the opponent is very strong. Therefore, you might as well get as much money in before your freeroll hits, which may scare away further action.

But again, this is just semantics. What matters more than anything is who else is in the hand with you, how they will interpret your action, etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

I find a lot of broadways will smooth call with position if you bet the pot, if they are out of position and you are near the button then it's more likely they will check raise "to get it in while good". What my arguement was that, if you check , then someone can't play back at you, if you bet then they can. But if you bet small, then you also get additional action from people with stone dead draws "who have value". I'm not sure betting the pot in this situation is good, especially since you have pretty much all the draws to the nuts that aren't going to be in other peoples hands.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

As you say they have to doubt what I hold to put money in the pot.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

Consider this though, this was $34 picked up from the pot i would have otherwise missed. Those situations will occur several times in a session more often than not on the river and to me, it's how to value bet successfully that makes the most money in this game.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

I want to go beyond this a bit.

In reverse thinking, say if I were to hold A2QX without nut flush redraw (or any other redraw possibilities), a tricky player (yeah like you [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] ) bet 1/4 of the pot and I had position on him, what's my best option?

1. Fold.
2. Call, if the turn pairs or completes flush possibility, fold. Then how about the river?
3. Minimum raise with the intention of folding if get potted back (Doing this will get myself run-over a lot in the future).
4. Pot back with the intention of folding if get potted back.

Clearly folding is the best option, am I too conservative?

What's your take?

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

[ QUOTE ]
But if you bet small, then you also get additional action from people with stone dead draws

[/ QUOTE ]

BINGO!

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

2)problem and fold to any bet bigger than half the pot if a scare card comes on the turn or river.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

[ QUOTE ]
I want to go beyond this a bit.

In reverse thinking, say if I were to hold A2QX without nut flush redraw (or any other redraw possibilities), a tricky player (yeah like you [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] ) bet 1/4 of the pot and I had position on him, what's my best option?

1. Fold.
2. Call, if the turn pairs or completes flush possibility, fold. Then how about the river?
3. Minimum raise with the intention of folding if get potted back (Doing this will get myself run-over a lot in the future).
4. Pot back with the intention of folding if get potted back.

Clearly folding is the best option, am I too conservative?

What's your take?

[/ QUOTE ]

Change Games.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

Haha, very funny. I never saw you quit, and I am not changing either.

Now when I think it again, options 2, 3, and 4 are the leaks of PLO8 play. I standby option 1 unless you come up with a real alternative.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

I disagree with you completely.

Here are my thoughts on option 2 & why I think it is correct-- as modified by me in my prior post.

First, you are getting 5/1 to call. I'd say conservatively there is at least a 1 in 3 chance you have the only nut straight, in which case-- I hope you would agree this is a terrible fold on your part.

Second, lets look at the worst case scenario, (you are facing a hand like Ribbo's heads up.) In that case, he has 17 outs to get ahead of you (assuming your xx cards are not spades). In this assumption you are getting 3-1 odds, and are a 2.6-1 favorite that he will not improve, but realistically you MAY be facing a $36 bet on the turn with the same odds, SO, you will be getting 5-1, where you are a 2.6-1 favorite on the flop, and 2-1 where you are a 2.6-1 favorite on the turn.

Even from common sense perspective that you ultimately may have risked $42 to get $12, on a hand that your opponent is a favorite to beat you on, you have to figure factor in the chances that he has this exact hand, which I think is far less than 1 in 3.

On balance, I think you have to call with the straight there or you are giving away money.

Re: How would YOU! play this hand:
 

Folding is way too conservative. Call. If the turn is a scare card and you get checked to, bet the pot. If it's not a scare card and you get another weak bet at you, it's read dependent whether you raise or call. Most of the time, a raise will be correct to knock out a draw. If the opponent is tricky, you might want to call down until you are still the nuts on the river. If a scare card hits and you face a strong bet, fold.

You will win a lot of big pots calling down with a BW when the bettor has top set.