Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

Woman bounced from Southwest flight for T-shirt
By Susan Voyles, Reno Gazette-Journal
RENO — A Washington state woman intends to press a civil-rights case against Southwest Airlines for booting her off a flight in Reno after fellow passengers complained about a message on her T-shirt.
Lorrie Heasley, of Woodland, Wash., was halfway home on a flight Tuesday that began in Los Angeles, wearing a T-shirt with the pictures of President Bush, Vice President Dick Cheney and Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and a phrase similar to the popular film, Meet the Fockers.

Heasley said she wore the T-shirt as a gag. She wanted her parents, who are Democrats, to see it when they picked her up at the airport in Portland, Ore.

"I just thought it was hilarious," said Heasley, 32, a lumber saleswoman.

And she felt she had the right to wear it.

"I have cousins in Iraq and other relatives going to war," she said. "Here we are trying to free another country and I have to get off an airplane in midflight over a T-shirt. That's not freedom."

Southwest Airlines spokeswoman Marilee McInnis said the T-shirt became an issue after several passengers complained. She said the airline's contract filed with the Federal Aviation Administration contains rules on passenger conduct.

Heasley said no one from Southwest said anything about the shirt when she waited two hours near the gate at Los Angeles International Airport. And neither the pilot, nor other crewmembers, said anything when she boarded the aircraft, Heasley added.

After the plane stopped in Reno at noon Tuesday, she and her husband, Ron, moved to the front of the plane. Passengers began complaining about the T-shirt as they boarded.

After several conversations with flight attendants, Heasley agreed to cover the words by cuddling up with a sweatshirt. When the sweatshirt slipped while she was trying to sleep, she was ordered to wear her T-shirt inside-out or leave. The couple chose to leave.

McInnis said the rules filed with the FAA say the airline will deny boarding to any customer whose conduct is offensive, abusive, disorderly or violent or for clothing that is "lewd, obscene, or patently offensive."

Allen Lichtenstein, lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union in Nevada, said Heasley's T-shirt is "protected" political speech under the Constitution. The real issue, he said, is that the airline allowed her to wear the shirt onboard and then objected only when people complained.

"That they changed rules in the middle of a flight simply because someone didn't like it and it might be problematic," he said.

FAA spokesman Donn Walker said no federal rules exist on the subject.

"It's up to the airlines who they want to take and by what rules," he said. "The government just doesn't get into the business of what people wear on an aircraft."

"At any point when a passenger has a complaint against another and it becomes an issue that could disrupt the flight, our attendants have the discretion to take the appropriate action," said Phil Gee, spokesman for US Airways.

Heasley said she is in touch with ACLU lawyers in Seattle. She wants Southwest to reimburse the couple for the last leg of their trip and pay for her gasoline, a $68 rental car from Avis and a $70 hotel bill.

Before leaving the plane, she said she was told the airline would reimburse her for the tickets for the last leg of the flight. After they got off the plane, they were told they'd be reimbursed only for the taxes on the tickets. McInnis said customer services officials are looking into the matter.

After fighting over the ticket prices, the couple got a hotel room in Reno, rented a car and got home Wednesday afternoon — about 24 hours after they left the plane.

"I have always flown Southwest everywhere I go," Heasley said. "I will never fly with them again. They can disrespect somebody else."

The Reno Gazette-Journal is owned by Gannett, USA TODAY's parent company


linkasauras

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

Did Time Warner buy out Southwest?

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]


McInnis said the rules filed with the FAA say the airline will deny boarding to any customer whose conduct is offensive, abusive, disorderly or violent or for clothing that is "lewd, obscene, or patently offensive."


[/ QUOTE ]

She loses. Case closed.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]
McInnis said the rules filed with the FAA say the airline will deny boarding to any customer whose conduct is offensive, abusive, disorderly or violent or for clothing that is "lewd, obscene, or patently offensive."



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She loses. Case closed.

[/ QUOTE ]

So which is it, lewd, obscene, or patently offensive?

lewd ( P ) Pronunciation Key (ld)
adj. lewd·er, lewd·est

Preoccupied with sex and sexual desire; lustful.
Obscene; indecent.
Obsolete. Wicked.


ob·scene ( P ) Pronunciation Key (b-sn, b-)
adj.
Offensive to accepted standards of decency or modesty.
Inciting lustful feelings; lewd.
Repulsive; disgusting: “The way he writes about the disease that killed her is simply obscene” (Michael Korda).
So large in amount as to be objectionable or outrageous: “local merchants in nearby stores get hammered by stratospheric rents and obscene taxes” (Joe Queenan).

pat·ent·ly ( P ) Pronunciation Key (ptnt-l, pt-)
adv.
In a patent manner; openly, plainly, or clearly: a patently false statement

of·fen·sive ( P ) Pronunciation Key (-fnsv)
adj.
Disagreeable to the senses: an offensive odor.
Causing anger, displeasure, resentment, or affront: an offensive gesture.

Making an attack: The offensive troops gained ground quickly.
Of, relating to, or designed for attack: offensive weapons.
(fn-) Sports. Of or relating to a team having possession of a ball or puck: the offensive line.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

All of the above. Well, ok, not lewd. But certainly obscene, I mean the shirt does contain an obscenity right?

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

No surprise for Southwest. Just watch Airline to see how much of a train wreck this airline is. They have cheap air because they treat you like cattle and have 0 customer service. Oh, and the flight attendants try to be funny and sing on flights sometimes. Before you are allowed to put on headphones.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]
No surprise for Southwest. Just watch Airline to see how much of a train wreck this airline is. They have cheap air because they treat you like cattle and have 0 customer service. Oh, and the flight attendants try to be funny and sing on flights sometimes. Before you are allowed to put on headphones.

[/ QUOTE ]

Funny, I fly Southwest all the time and have loved flying with them.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

This, to me, is another example of me being sickened by all the parties involved.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

The best solution would have been to throw the complainers off the plane in mid air.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

I recently read that Southwest has confidence-inspiring record of zero plane crashes.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

I agree. I only fly Southwest if possible.

Apparently our flights were the only ones where the passengers weren't treated like cattle. Lucky us!

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

The woman was not kicked off for a political shirt, she was kicked off for public obscenity. I am assuming from the story that the shirt had a clear variation of the F-word. T-shirts, bumper stickers, etc., that contain dirty words are juvenile, offensive, and uncivil. The political content is not relevant.

There are certain things that mature, civilized people do not do in public. A shirt like that is no more appropriate in a public environment than loud cursing or being sloppy drunk. The woman is an idiot.

That said, the airline people are idiots too. If the woman had the shirt clearly visible, she should not have been allowed on the plane in the first place. There is no infringement of rights in a policy like that if it is uniformly enforced.

[ QUOTE ]
Allen Lichtenstein, lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union in Nevada, said Heasley's T-shirt is "protected" political speech under the Constitution.

[/ QUOTE ]

The lawyer is an idiot too. Obscenity in a political context is still obscene.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

I wonder how Southwest could have changed the rules "in the middle of the flight," and that "the couple decided to leave." If that had really happened, the problem would have been solved instantly, no? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Next time, just wear the damned thing inside out and don't get the damned lawyers involved. Then turn it right side out when you're getting off the plane. Wouldn't that have been easier?

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

Alas, something on which we agree.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

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...she was ordered to wear her T-shirt inside-out or leave. The couple chose to leave.

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Aha, the truth comes out. She wasn't "kicked off" the flight, she chose to get off.

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Allen Lichtenstein, lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union in Nevada, said Heasley's T-shirt is "protected" political speech under the Constitution. The real issue, he said, is that the airline allowed her to wear the shirt onboard and then objected only when people complained.

[/ QUOTE ]
HA! "Protected speech" indeed! Since when does a company have to provide you with service? Now if the airlines and passengers had no problem with this but the government had some rule against it, he might have a case. I don't see how this doesn't get laughed out of court.

[ QUOTE ]
Heasley said she is in touch with ACLU lawyers in Seattle. She wants Southwest to reimburse the couple for the last leg of their trip and pay for her gasoline, a $68 rental car from Avis and a $70 hotel bill.

Before leaving the plane, she said she was told the airline would reimburse her for the tickets for the last leg of the flight. After they got off the plane, they were told they'd be reimbursed only for the taxes on the tickets. McInnis said customer services officials are looking into the matter.

[/ QUOTE ]
I think Southwest should refund her the last leg of the flight and nothing else. It was her decision to leave the airplane, so she should bear the consequences of that action.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

I'm constantly amazed by how many people (woman on the plane included) don't seem to understand the meaning of the term Free Speech.

Free Speech does not mean speech without consequences. This woman is fully entitled to wear that shirt AND Southwest is fully entitled to throw her off the flight.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]
The woman was not kicked off for a political shirt, she was kicked off for public obscenity. I am assuming from the story that the shirt had a clear variation of the F-word. T-shirts, bumper stickers, etc., that contain dirty words are juvenile, offensive, and uncivil. The political content is not relevant.

There are certain things that mature, civilized people do not do in public. A shirt like that is no more appropriate in a public environment than loud cursing or being sloppy drunk. The woman is an idiot.

That said, the airline people are idiots too. If the woman had the shirt clearly visible, she should not have been allowed on the plane in the first place. There is no infringement of rights in a policy like that if it is uniformly enforced.

[ QUOTE ]
Allen Lichtenstein, lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union in Nevada, said Heasley's T-shirt is "protected" political speech under the Constitution.

[/ QUOTE ]

The lawyer is an idiot too. Obscenity in a political context is still obscene.

[/ QUOTE ]

This just makes me laugh.

That 'clear variation' of the F word, was shown day-and-night on TV and print ads for the mainstream movie referenced. Viewable by impressionable children, etc. etc. Everyone went 'wink wink.' So this notion that the woman wearing the T-shirt was hassled for an 'obscenity,' as opposed to a political opinion, is nonsense.

Frank

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

As die-hard of a supporter of the First Amendment I am(and really, I go pretty overboard), I must concede that I side with Southwest on this one, simply because, as the poster before me just implicated, Southwest is not obligated to provide service to anyone.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]

That 'clear variation' of the F word, was shown day-and-night on TV and print ads for the mainstream movie referenced. Viewable by impressionable children, etc. etc. Everyone went 'wink wink.' So this notion that the woman wearing the T-shirt was hassled for an 'obscenity,' as opposed to a political opinion, is nonsense.

Frank

[/ QUOTE ]


Try reading the posts.

The article said that the shirt had "...a phrase similar to the popular film, Meet the Fockers." That means that she was not wearing a "Meet the Fockers" t-shirt.

We who read the post are all assuming from the article that the "o" was replaced with a "u" on the shirt, and that was what people objected to.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]
As die-hard of a supporter of the First Amendment I am(and really, I go pretty overboard), I must concede that I side with Southwest on this one, simply because, as the poster before me just implicated, Southwest is not obligated to provide service to anyone.

[/ QUOTE ]

The First Amendment protects you from infringement of the right to free speech by the government. I don't have any obligation to afford you free speech, and a company has no obligation to provide anyone with the opportunity to free speech.

Contrary to the statements made, Southwest does have a certain obligation to provide service. As a licensed common carrier, it cannot discriminate, and must provide service to anyone who follows its rules. If it has rules that it enforces equally and without discrimination, then it can deny service to anyone who violates those rules.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

That 'clear variation' of the F word, was shown day-and-night on TV and print ads for the mainstream movie referenced. Viewable by impressionable children, etc. etc. Everyone went 'wink wink.' So this notion that the woman wearing the T-shirt was hassled for an 'obscenity,' as opposed to a political opinion, is nonsense.

Frank

[/ QUOTE ]


Try reading the posts.

The article said that the shirt had "...a phrase similar to the popular film, Meet the Fockers." That means that she was not wearing a "Meet the Fockers" t-shirt.

We who read the post are all assuming from the article that the "o" was replaced with a "u" on the shirt, and that was what people objected to.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oops. Your right, I was wrong.

Too bad. I think not using the 'u' would have made the shirt just as effective a political statement, without breaking any rules. As it stands, she did wear a shirt with a recognized obscenity, and hence she doesn't have much of a case against Southwest.

Frank

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

You know what I can't figure out? She was willing to cover up the shirt with a sweatshirt she had, but unwilling to either put on said sweatshirt or turn her t-shirt inside out?

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

Okay...yes...I agree with that. I was referring to the example at hand, not a general business practice.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

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Next time, just wear the damned thing inside out and don't get the damned lawyers involved. Then turn it right side out when you're getting off the plane. Wouldn't that have been easier?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, but not potentially as profitable.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

The people who complained about the T-Shirts are idiots.

Getting upset about F-Words on T-Shirts (or internet forums) is OK for the Leave it to Beaver crowd. It is pretty much part of the lexicon today, from middle school upwards (for better or for worse).

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

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It is pretty much part of the lexicon today, from middle school upwards (for better or for worse).

[/ QUOTE ]

It got to be that way because people did not complain and because teachers are too scared to tell children that they are doing something wrong, for fear of traumatising them or being sued for infringement of free speech.

"Everyone does it" is not an excuse for incivility and rudeness, any more than it is a justification for a young child to get a tattoo or to smoke dope. People who do not object to rude behaviour are cowardly and contribute to the problem. People who are rude or who excuse rudeness on the basis that everyone does it are sheep following the herd.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

Something being commonplace doesn't make it less obscene.

It comes down to this:
You have a right to say/wear what you want.

Other people have a right to react to what you say/wear.

Private businesses have a right to make decisions based on any criteria they want.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

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Private businesses have a right to make decisions based on any criteria they want.

[/ QUOTE ]

In this case clearly dropping the F-bomb on a shirt was out of line and I have no problem with Southwest making the decision it did. However private companies that use public property (like airports) and public employees (like flight controllers) can't just make decisions like this willy-nilly: for example, Southwest should have no more right to throw me off for wearing a Kerry-Edwards shirt than it would for someone wearing an Alaska Airlines logo.

Anyway, they should have just made her step outside for 10 minutes like they do in WSOP. (Now that's a stupid F-bomb rule IMHO.)

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

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The people who complained about the T-Shirts are idiots.

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Agreed.

We have become quite the whiney little bitch of a nation, haven't we?

I wonder if she would have put a little piece of tape on her shirt, converting the u to an o if the complainers would have shut up. Doubt it.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]

In this case clearly dropping the F-bomb on a shirt was out of line and I have no problem with Southwest making the decision it did. However private companies that use public property (like airports) and public employees (like flight controllers) can't just make decisions like this willy-nilly: for example, Southwest should have no more right to throw me off for wearing a Kerry-Edwards shirt than it would for someone wearing an Alaska Airlines logo.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't forget they are an industry heavily subsidized by the government

Melch

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]

In this case clearly dropping the F-bomb on a shirt was out of line and I have no problem with Southwest making the decision it did. However private companies that use public property (like airports) and public employees (like flight controllers) can't just make decisions like this willy-nilly.



[/ QUOTE ]

They didn't make the decision willy-nilly. They have rules, approved by the FAA, that prohibit obscene behavior and clothing.

[ QUOTE ]
for example, Southwest should have no more right to throw me off for wearing a Kerry-Edwards shirt than it would for someone wearing an Alaska Airlines logo

[/ QUOTE ]

Those are political issues, not prohibited by the rules. Despite the OP's title, this is not a political issue, it is an issue of public obscenity. Sorry, I meant to say public idiocy.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

Well put, ben, as you got back here before I did.

This woman violated the "Terms and Agreements" of her airline ticket. The company doesn't have established rules against political views, other companies, or other such arbitrary examples.

They do have an obscenity rule. There is little doubt that the F-Bomb can be, and often is, construed to be an obscene word.

They gave her the chance to rectify the situation and continue on the flight. She declined. If she was doing this as an act of civil disobedience, she needs to own up to the consequences of her choice. Even if it is an extra $200 or so out of pocket.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

In this case clearly dropping the F-bomb on a shirt was out of line and I have no problem with Southwest making the decision it did. However private companies that use public property (like airports) and public employees (like flight controllers) can't just make decisions like this willy-nilly.



[/ QUOTE ]

They didn't make the decision willy-nilly. They have rules, approved by the FAA, that prohibit obscene behavior and clothing.

[/ QUOTE ]

Try reading what I wrote next time. I never said Southwest acted willy-nilly. In fact, I agree that Southwest acted appropriately. I was responding to this statement:

[ QUOTE ]
Private businesses have a right to make decisions based on any criteria they want.

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The statement that private business can make such decisions as they see fit (or, as I put it, willy-nilly) is totally wrong. It is especially wrong for businesses that live off of government like airlines. However, in this particular case Southwest acted appropriately, and did not act willy-nilly.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

Surely businesses have a right to make decisions based on what they want. Whether or not those decisions come alongside consequences is not the point.

How else can casinos refuse service to anyone, could fast-food joints refuse service to customers, bars cut off drunks, or sporting event security escort out abrasive fans?

Could any of these result in problems? Sure, I suppose so. But private businesses make their decisions based on the criteria that they see fit. SW Airlines wasn't saying this woman couldn't fly. They were saying she couldin't fly on this flight with that shirt on. And, because she refused to cooperate with their requests, they don't owe her anything.

Re: Woman Kicked of Southwest flight for political T shirt
 

[ QUOTE ]
Surely businesses have a right to make decisions based on what they want. Whether or not those decisions come alongside consequences is not the point.

How else can casinos refuse service to anyone, could fast-food joints refuse service to customers, bars cut off drunks, or sporting event security escort out abrasive fans?

Could any of these result in problems? Sure, I suppose so. But private businesses make their decisions based on the criteria that they see fit. SW Airlines wasn't saying this woman couldn't fly. They were saying she couldin't fly on this flight with that shirt on. And, because she refused to cooperate with their requests, they don't owe her anything.

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Chalk this one up to willfully disregarding what I'm saying. Within limits, airlines can set policies. But let's say the person was kicked off the airplane for being a white woman. Clearly that would be a violation of federal law (and probably other laws). The commerce clause gives the federal government this authority. Likewise if the woman were kicked off the plane for wearing a shirt that said: "i like president bush" it would be a violation of her civil rights. the fact that her shirt was obviously offensive is what makes it okay, plus the likelihood that southwest has clearly spelled out policies on handling such occurences. it's not that they can do whatever they want, it's that they have the right to protect other passengers from lewd, obscene, and patently offensive shirts.