18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Ok, so technically this is 10 days early, but I don’t want to write it up during the holidays. Some of you read this post where I chronicled my first year as an underage poker player. A lot has changed in the last 6 month, both good and bad, but in the poker realm it was mostly good. Over the summer, I moved up to 10-20 and 20-40 with some good success. I made around 40k over the summer, which was as much as I made during my first 12 months playing. The summer was very fun, I had a good time enjoying the last few months with my good friends, and making a lot of money didn’t hurt! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Coming into school in September, a lot was changing. I missed my good friends, and my relationship with my long-term girlfriend self destructed. I was in an emotional rut for quite a while. Fortunately, during September, I was also running very well and end up having my best month of poker ever (42k) which helped alleviate some of the emotional turbulence I was handling. However, I hit a wall in October. I was feeling good about my game, but unfortunately I was running obscenely bad at 100-200. I lost 43k in 6600 hands there, and ended the month down 20k. My grandmother also passed away, and combined with the worst month of poker career and adapting to college, it was not a fun month. I drank way too much, and I don’t’ mean normal go away to college drinking. Fortunately, I am a self-aware person, and I knew I needed to get myself back on a better track.

At the beginning of November, I flew out to Vegas out met up with some 2+2 buddies, including NLsoldier, BK, Schneider, etc… I have kinda idolized these guys for a while, so it was very cool to meet them in person, although I had already met some in September when I flew out to Minnesota to go to a Badgers game with them. Anyway, Vegas was an absolute blast, one of the best weekends of my life. This propelled me to a good start poker-wise in November. Around the 10th of November, I was bored one night and started playing 2K No-limit. I pulled a James and started running stupidly hot. Even though I was probably a marginal player, I started crushing the games. I made a stupid amount of $$$ in November, and I started to put some of my emotional baggage behind me. Not completely, but I was/am making good progress.

At the beginning of this month I took some shots at 25-50 and 50-100 NL. I don’t mind sharing figures since it wont come across as bragging. I had my biggest day ever on the first of the month, making 42k. By the 4th I was up 75k, and feeling great about my game. I then managed to pull a -63k downswing in 24 hours playing 25-50 NL, which made me reconsider if I wanted to deal with the emotional turbulence which comes with playing these stakes. Currently I have decided to stick to the 2K NL games, and the month has continued to be incredibly turbulent, but all things considered, I am doing well. I never thought I would have independent downswings of 63k, 38k, and 30k in 15 days and still be up 35 thousand dollars in that time span. I have invested a lot of time into improving my game, and I am pleased with the results. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

So, I have some words of wisdom that I would like to share. There are no absolutes in poker, so you will never hear me talk about them. But what I am absolutely sure of is that your biggest or worst day of poker will not be the best or worst day of your. Work hard, learn, and keep everything in perspective. Poker is a game to some, a job to others, but it should only be a small part of who you are regardless. I would like to say that from limited conversations with guys like BK, Schneider, James and company, I have learned a lot not only about poker, but how to balance it with the rest of your life. I hope to continue to improve at poker and at life, and especially at balancing the two of them together.

As far as moving up and taking shots, do so at your own comfort level. Don’t try to be like or keep pace with anyone. Some people get lucky at the right times and others don’t. But hard work and discipline will get you where you need to be. Also, what is even more important that learning the game is learning to be content. I still have a lot to learn in this regard. I can honestly say that I don’t want to be that guy that doesn’t know when to stop pushing himself; who always needs to be the best to be happy. Focus on getting yourself to a point where you can make the most money with the least emotional turbulence. If you can lose enough money to ruin your day, you’re playing to high. No matter what, be grateful for what you have. In poker and in life, [censored] hits the fan sometimes. This is kind of corny, but I’ll say it anyway. I’m 18 so naturally I ignore a good portion of the advice my parents give me, but one thing my father told always seems to ring true. He said, “Son, everyone gets opportunities, some people just make more out of them.” If you want to be a good poker player, there will be ups, there will be downs, but you will only set yourself back by feeling sorry for yourself and letting it affect your outside life. Deal with it, move on, and don’t let poker affect the way you are when your not playing/

I have a lot of goals for the next few years, and many of them don’t pertain to poker. My new years resolution will be to get back in good physical shape and be more outgoing and meet people in college. I want to continue to improve my game as well, but this will take a back seat to other parts of my life. I hope some people find this helpful, that is the main reason I am writing it. I am very grateful for being blessed, and remorseful for when I don’t appreciate it enough. I would like to thank my family, friends, and 2+2 for the support that has allowed me to get where I am today.

Peace,

Gabe

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Good post Gabe. Not much else I can say but I gotta give you props.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Awesome post man, good to have you around.

blake

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

[ QUOTE ]
I then managed to pull a -63k downswing in 24 hours playing 25-50 NL

[/ QUOTE ]

i don't understand this. don't you have a stop loss?

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

No, i felt i was +EV in the games i was playing, i was playing a lot against a guy who is known for running up his role at 10-20 and losing it at 25-50. He had major leaks in his game, icluding opening hands like K6s and calling re-raises. It might have been possible to "only" lose 50k over this stretch, but most of it was brutal luck. I have seen plenty of good and bad variance latley.

Also, just to clarify, i lost 38k one night and 25 the next morning, it was not all in one session, but it was within 24 hours.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

So you've been playing $2k NL or higher for one month. lol, you're such a seasoned pro.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

[ QUOTE ]
No, i felt i was +EV in the games i was playing, i was playing a lot against a guy who is known for running up his role at 10-20 and losing it at 25-50. He had major leaks in his game, icluding opening hands like K6s and calling re-raises.

[/ QUOTE ]

ruh roh? You talking about fish daddy here?

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Haha not at all, just running well in general, particularly in the 2K NL. I think i may have have run a bit poorly in my higher shots, but in general i was detered by the variance i had. (And note that my both my upswings and my downswings were ubscene given the time frame BB wise, not $$$-wise)

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

That was a good read. You speak of many very true points. GL in the future.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Dam man, i got a bad habit of comparing my self to others. You 18 and so am i... Only difference is. You play 20/40 and i play 1/2 and take shots at 2/4 6max [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] LOL.

These kind of posts, as with BK's also - Really make me want to move up faster. I guess its because the money sounds so amazing and i've always considered money to be a part of happyness in the sense it removes a worry of "When will we next eat?".

Nice post, added to favourites to motivate me.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

very nice post.

i can't even imagine what it is like to have that much money at freaking 18.
Guys like you and zeejustin and others just blow me away.

I'm 35 and am a bit jealous I think.


You've got a pretty good head on your shoulders for ANY age as best I can tell (much less 18) and it's pretty impressive.

Nice post and continued success at poker, college, life, etc.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

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I had my biggest day ever on the first of the month, making 42k.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow. I've never had that much money in my life. You're three years younger than me and you made that in a day. Of course, there were those few times when you lost more than I've ever had in one day too :P

Interesting read. Definitely motivating to see what others are capable of achieving. Congrats on your success, and thanks for sharing.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

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I'm 35 and am a bit jealous I think.


[/ QUOTE ]

You shouldn't be - it's much easier to move up the stakes so rapidly when your much younger: Much lower outgoings from your bankroll, less financial repsonsibilty and greater risk tolerance means you can take more "shots", they have more spare time on their hands, not to mention the fact that they learn faster than us [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

And to Gabe, good on you. It's been said before, but you come across as being a really mature & smart 18yo -- you deserve your success. However, you should really spend the next years enjoying college, your wealth & youth, and tone down on the poker a little. At least that would stop people like me and microbob being so jealous......

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Interesting post, I am a 53 year old father of two, a son who is getting out of the navy soon and my daughter who is a sophmore at your school. I am considering trying poker fulltime soon and I am get jealous like micro bob said at your success at the tables but perhaps even more so at your maturity as I still struggle in that area. Good luck at school and life and keep posting I have just moved to no-limit poker after 100k hands of limit and I enjoy reading your posts. And stay away from my daughter lol.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

[ QUOTE ]
Interesting post, I am a 53 year old father of two, a son who is getting out of the navy soon and my daughter who is a sophmore at your school. I am considering trying poker fulltime soon and I am get jealous like micro bob said at your success at the tables but perhaps even more so at your maturity as I still struggle in that area. Good luck at school and life and keep posting I have just moved to no-limit poker after 100k hands of limit and I enjoy reading your posts. And stay away from my daughter lol.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you decide you want to give poker a whirl full time, best of luck to you. I would reccomend getting in some more hands before you make any decisions, you can never have too much experience.

And of course i will stay away from your daughter, just tell me her name so i know it's her... [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Good post. I'm 24 and just finishing up college. Late I know but that is another story. Anyways, I'm not making what you are but I am still making signifigantly more than I ever have before, and much more than what any entry level position will pay me. Plus, I've been playing for 9 months so I'm sure there much more for me to learn and advance. It's always interesting hearing what people in similiar situations to myself are thinking/doing.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

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I hope some people find this helpful

[/ QUOTE ]

more than helpful, seriously...thx a bunch ggb and continued gl

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

great post...I'm a bit older than you (33) but i had the run of a lifetime over the summer also and then have hit a bad run now...not sure why but I loved the post and really wish you the best of luck

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

[ QUOTE ]

So, I have some words of wisdom that I would like to share. There are no absolutes in poker, so you will never hear me talk about them. But what I am absolutely sure of is that your biggest or worst day of poker will not be the best or worst day of your. Work hard, learn, and keep everything in perspective. Poker is a game to some, a job to others, but it should only be a small part of who you are regardless. I would like to say that from limited conversations with guys like BK, Schneider, James and company, I have learned a lot not only about poker, but how to balance it with the rest of your life. I hope to continue to improve at poker and at life, and especially at balancing the two of them together.


As far as moving up and taking shots, do so at your own comfort level. Don’t try to be like or keep pace with anyone. Some people get lucky at the right times and others don’t. But hard work and discipline will get you where you need to be. Also, what is even more important that learning the game is learning to be content. I still have a lot to learn in this regard. I can honestly say that I don’t want to be that guy that doesn’t know when to stop pushing himself; who always needs to be the best to be happy. Focus on getting yourself to a point where you can make the most money with the least emotional turbulence. If you can lose enough money to ruin your day, you’re playing to high. No matter what, be grateful for what you have. In poker and in life, [censored] hits the fan sometimes. This is kind of corny, but I’ll say it anyway. I’m 18 so naturally I ignore a good portion of the advice my parents give me, but one thing my father told always seems to ring true. He said, “Son, everyone gets opportunities, some people just make more out of them.” If you want to be a good poker player, there will be ups, there will be downs, but you will only set yourself back by feeling sorry for yourself and letting it affect your outside life. Deal with it, move on, and don’t let poker affect the way you are when your not playing/

Gabe

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These 2 paragraphs should be sticked at the top of every stakes level forum and the psychology forum.

Nh sir.

regards

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

[ QUOTE ]
I drank way too much, and I don’t’ mean normal go away to college drinking. Fortunately, I am a self-aware person, and I knew I needed to get myself back on a better track.

At the beginning of November, I flew out to Vegas ...

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice job recognizing your faults and coming up with a plan to fix them. Drinking too much? Fly to Vegas!

-Eric

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

great post dude!!!

do u have AIM or something, cuz i have a few questions i want to ask you. maybe PM. maybe you dont want to talk me at all lol!!!

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Since you're young like me, and since you provided us with such good advice, I'd like to share some good advice with you:

Never let anyone know how much dough you hold. Having that much money comes with a few set of rules that you don't want to learn the hard way.

Congrats on the recent success. Invest some of that money and enjoy college.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Kowalski,

"Having that much money comes with a few set of rules that you don't want to learn the hard way."

What are those rules? Thanks!

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Nice post and congrats.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Great, great post.

See you at the 2k NL tables(someday lol)

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

I just don't want to see the kid get robbed/scammed/heldup you know what I mean?

Just be careful.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

You seem wise beyond your years. For an 18 yr old, that's an extremely impressive characteristic and something to be proud of. Good job, GL.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

I think there's a reason the best/highest-stakes players on this site are usually under 25. When you're that young (I'm 20), the money doesn't really sink in and you can risk tens of thousands playing some dumb card game. More mature people realize the value of $25k, but for me, I now have all the money I need at the moment and any extra is just gravy. This lets me gamble what non-poker-players would consider a huge amount of money.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

I think the shot-taking idea because they're young is a valid point...but don't overlook the likelhood that some of them are just pretty damn good players and are awfully dedicated to learning.

A little luck is helpful to go along with some serious skills and abilities of course.
But I think these many of these guys would have made it to where they are sooner or later.
The internet allows you to just play SO MANY freaking hands....and, of course, study study study, discuss and learn.

I think it's far more than just an issue of luck for many of young talents like Gabe....and I think the ideas he expresses in this post are evidence of that.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

There's also the fact that kids have more free time to devote to playing and learning. There are probably lots of 30-year-old+ players who have the talent and ability to become successful high-stakes poker players, but don't have the 1-2 years to devote all their time towards doing it. Kids under 25 have the best opportunity to flourish at poker, and it just happens that there are a good amount of really smart kids under 25 that visit this site. If those guys miss out on poker before reaching 30, I doubt they end up where they are now.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I drank way too much, and I don’t’ mean normal go away to college drinking. Fortunately, I am a self-aware person, and I knew I needed to get myself back on a better track.

At the beginning of November, I flew out to Vegas ...

[/ QUOTE ]

Nice job recognizing your faults and coming up with a plan to fix them. Drinking too much? Fly to Vegas!

-Eric

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha i capped off my drinking problem in Vegas. I am seriously confident that i got comped more $$$ in drinks in 2 days than the room was worth. On a more serious note however, since then i have made a habit of consuming less drinks when i am drinking, which i am pleased about.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

Anyone can always feel free to PM me, and anyone who does can chait with me on AIM.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

[ QUOTE ]
There's also the fact that kids have more free time to devote to playing and learning. There are probably lots of 30-year-old+ players who have the talent and ability to become successful high-stakes poker players, but don't have the 1-2 years to devote all their time towards doing it. Kids under 25 have the best opportunity to flourish at poker, and it just happens that there are a good amount of really smart kids under 25 that visit this site. If those guys miss out on poker before reaching 30, I doubt they end up where they are now.

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this is somewhat true of course for many situations...however, i have all the free-time in the world to devote to poker and I still suck.
there are many others out there like me.

It still takes a great deal of skill and discipline. Just because you have the time to devote to it doesn't make it easy.
Lots of college students have some advantages here....but most college students suck as much (if not moreso) at poker as anyone else.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think there's a reason the best/highest-stakes players on this site are usually under 25.

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1. They have more leisure time to learn the game.

2. They usually have fewer financial responsibilities, so they can commit to building their bankroll instead of paying off debts.

3. They are usually not entrenched in a job, so they can afford to take a chance by playing pro poker.

4. They often learn poker while still in school or right after finishing--they are ripe to learn from book/forum study.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

What I'm saying is that the really smart successful young high-stakes poker players wouldn't be high-stakes poker players if they were introduced to poker at 30. They would be off doing something else at a high level that probably requires a large investment of time, and most would be very successful. I think many of the very successful and very good players on this site would be very successful even without poker.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

One of the better posts i've read, i really hope everything will work out great for you. You have motivated me a lot with this post.

if it wasn\'t for 2plus2, my children would be starving
 

I have also been playing poker for 18 months now, and I found it interesting to compare your progress to mine. I started out playing micro-stakes limit in the summer of '04, losing about half a grand before I decided to quit. But in the back of my mind, I knew that I had to keep playing, that I could beat this wretched game. So I deposited $5o into PP this March and played $25 NL. And I started winning. And winning. So I started moving up in stakes, where I continued to run good. I am the kind of person whose performance suffers when not challenged/stimulated enough, so when I started running bad at $400 NL I started taking shots in the bigger games. As of now I play 5-10 NL and higher, and I'm still running good.
What's funny is that my goal in March was to be a winning player at 100 NL by the end of the year. Never in my wildest dreams did I see myself playing 10-25 against Esfandiari. I would just like to say that there is no way I would be where I am at today without 2plus2. Thank you all.

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

You are that rarest of things. An eighteen year old with his head screwed on.

Good post and good luck for the future.

RH

PS I hope your parking some of that loot you're making in long term investments (preferably the locked in kind you can't touch) - compound interest is a wonderful thing for someone so young to be able to tap into.

Re: if it wasn\'t for 2plus2, my children would be starving
 

[ QUOTE ]
I have also been playing poker for 18 months now, and I found it interesting to compare your progress to mine. I started out playing micro-stakes limit in the summer of '04, losing about half a grand before I decided to quit. But in the back of my mind, I knew that I had to keep playing, that I could beat this wretched game. So I deposited $5o into PP this March and played $25 NL. And I started winning. And winning. So I started moving up in stakes, where I continued to run good. I am the kind of person whose performance suffers when not challenged/stimulated enough, so when I started running bad at $400 NL I started taking shots in the bigger games. As of now I play 5-10 NL and higher, and I'm still running good.
What's funny is that my goal in March was to be a winning player at 100 NL by the end of the year. Never in my wildest dreams did I see myself playing 10-25 against Esfandiari. I would just like to say that there is no way I would be where I am at today without 2plus2. Thank you all.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'll set the over under at Valentine's Day, anyone want action?

Re: 18 Months of poker and what i have learned
 

You have always seemed somewhat well strung with your self awareness but your shooting up stakes seems like you want to ride the variance rollercoaster. You will probably think those days are over because you hit badly once, but they are probably far from over. No matter the level of your poker skills, the level of stakes you play or the size of your bankroll there are always bigger games and there are always stakes in which with a bad run you could go totally bust. The reason i meantioned this was because about 3 times you meantion how the swings in poker had an effect on your mood when over events should have engulfed it,

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My grandmother also passed away, and combined with the worst month of poker career and adapting to college, it was not a fun month.

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[ QUOTE ]
I missed my good friends, and my relationship with my long-term girlfriend self destructed. I was in an emotional rut for quite a while. Fortunately, during September, I was also running very well and end up having my best month of poker ever (42k) which helped alleviate some of the emotional turbulence I was handling

[/ QUOTE ]

In both of those quotes, the event poker is coupled with should [for a professional] easily outweigh whatever poker swings you go on. Having the fact if you are up for a day/week/month control if you are happy or not is unhealthy. You are flipping a coin for whatever mood you are in.

Hopefully you can use your self awareness to monitor how much poker affects your mood and progress with correcting it.

Along the way you will realise poker is a very emotional game and controlling your homelife and mind state is just as important as focusing on your game. While we see many kids shoot up stakes and win big a lot, there are tons of older people who grind out very successfully, because they live more balanced and organised lives.

Best of luck.