typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

villian is 24/14/3, dont know much else, he seems to be pretty good

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, SB calls.

Flop: (6 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, SB calls.

Turn: (4 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks.

River: (4 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero ???

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

can't help you, i don't three bet A3s in this situation

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

[ QUOTE ]
can't help you, i don't three bet A3s in this situation

[/ QUOTE ]

pretend you misclicked [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

actually i bet the turn in that situation.

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

what's his atsb%? I'd probably call and make a note of what he had.

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

Easy turn bet. I fold this river against good TAG about 3/4 of the time.

-DeathDonkey

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

Bet the turn. There is a good chance that you have the best hand and he was just peeling the flop with something like Q8, KT, or whatever.

Now look at the turn card and all the things it did for you:

1. Nut flush draw.

2. Reduced chance of facing a jack.

3. New hidden outs versus a five or small pocket pair.

4. Kicker damage to sevens and fives. From Villain's perspective a hand like T7 or Q5 just took a nasty out reduction when the board overpaired. Why does this matter? Because it may stop the checkraise.

4. Improved chances of chopping another ace.

This check with outs thing is overdone. Being more aggressive with extra pot equity is often a good thing.

As played I think you signed up to call the river. This is a pretty good board for winning unimproved.

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

I'd expect a TAG to c/r this flop with Js a fair amount of time, so that holding can be discounted some. Given that, I really think you should bet the turn here. Nut flush draw, better chance of splitting with another A, all that good stuff that's been mentioned.

The river is tougher. If he has a read on you, he has to think that you'd value bet almost any pair on the turn, and would only check behind some A-high hands and draws. And if he's good, he's not going to bet if he expects you to fold near 100% of the time, as you would with any draw. So this might be an A hoping to fold a weakly-played better A, but more often I think he's betting a hand better than A-high (or at least most A-high), since he wouldn't make a bet with no value. He should know you're intent on either folding the river UI or trying to get to showdown with a not-so-great hand, which in this case would not include most pairs.

Its late, did that make any sense?

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

he checked twice. You have positon, a good draw, a chance of having the current best hand. Why wouldn't you bet

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

i misread action. sorry.

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out *DELETED*
 

Post deleted by cartman

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

hey cartman, he has the nut flush draw on the turn.

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

[ QUOTE ]
hey cartman, he has the nut flush draw on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks. I'm a moron. I think this poker thing may be too hard for me. I'm going to stick with the flop sidebets from now on.

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

When u 3bet preflop, dont u think they will call on flop more since they now got great odds? So u have to bet thinner on turn?

Agree with most others, this flop is way to drawish to think he is hit by a pair. Bet turn.

Another thing about 3bet preflop: Isnt it better to do this with KQ, KJ, KT, QJ type of hands because then he will almost always fold Axx flop and we get those A-outs for free and win more when we are hit by lower card?

When we 3bet Ax against a good player we will get no action if flop is A-high.

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

[ QUOTE ]
When u 3bet preflop, dont u think they will call on flop more since they now got great odds? So u have to bet thinner on turn?

Agree with most others, this flop is way to drawish to think he is hit by a pair. Bet turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, I really messed that up. I wasnt even thinking about the pot being bigger or any of that. I was playing weak and when I picked up the draw, but it paired the top card, I just had one of those gut feelings I was going to get check raised (which obviously I should ignore). Then I put myself in the spot of having to decide on whether to call the river, and I realized this was a pretty common spot, why didnt I feel better about what to do? (maybe its just common cuz I misplay the turn a lot, im gunna go back over hands now)

[ QUOTE ]
Another thing about 3bet preflop: Isnt it better to do this with KQ, KJ, KT, QJ type of hands because then he will almost always fold Axx flop and we get those A-outs for free and win more when we are hit by lower card?

When we 3bet Ax against a good player we will get no action if flop is A-high.

[/ QUOTE ]

I 3 bet here because I was pretty sure I had the best hand. Id been folding my blind a lot, and this guy was pretty aggresive. 3 bettng A3s isnt my standard play, but I definitely will do it if I think its right. I figured this was one of those times.

Re: typical situation, that ive still never managed to figure out
 

Id bet the turn. THe way you played it Im calling the river but not like it much because most people are smart enough not to bluff on paired boards vs a guy who probably has an ace.