semi bluff raise
 

SB: unknown, BB: 44%/5%. AF:3,
MP3: 23%/3% AF: 0.43

When I saw the raise I immediatly thought he was on a semi bluff raise with a flush or OESD. I thought there was a good chance I was ahead. The decision is to either reraise or fold. With an ugly board and four players to act behind I folded.

good decision or bad? And why?

Party Poker 2.00/4.00 Hold'em <font color="#0000FF">(10 handed)</font> link

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
Hero calls, <font color="#666666">1 folds</font>, UTG+2 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP3 calls, CO calls, <font color="#666666">1 folds</font>, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6.00 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(6 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises</font>, Hero folds, UTG+2 folds, MP3 calls, CO folds, SB calls.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

Isn't this a perfect example of a raise to protect your weak hand situation? That's what BB may have been doing, protecting his draw or big 9. There are a lot of draws out there to dodge but you can still improve while avoiding their draws, I might have 3-bet here to try and get rid of people behind me.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

Raise you have top pair and position on the two. Getting almost 5 to 1 call, you should raise here with top pair top kicker. If the turn is safe a bet will frequently take down the pot.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

Any comments on just calling UTG with A9s. I don't do this at 2/4 on party. Others?

On the flop, I think I 3-bet here and see if bb caps.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

*grunch*

I think you made a good fold. The board is pretty coordinated, so there could be straight and flush draws out there. The best you can hope for is to get another 9 or an ace, which still loses if someone makes a straight or flush. Given the lack of preflop raising, the SB and BB (or others for that matter) could very well have the low cards needed for the straight.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

[ QUOTE ]
you should raise here with top pair top kicker. If the turn is safe a bet will frequently take down the pot.

[/ QUOTE ]
I disagree

Re: semi bluff raise
 

[ QUOTE ]
Any comments on just calling UTG with A9s.

[/ QUOTE ]
bad and I think you know why

Re: semi bluff raise
 

Yossalah, are you saying you raise UTG with this, or throwing it away?

Re: semi bluff raise
 

depends on the table and players. Both are acceptable

edit - you do understand why limping sucks here, right?

Re: semi bluff raise
 

Ditch this hand pre-flop from UTG. Problem solved.

Since you played it, I think this is a reraise or fold situation. With the texture of this flop I would lean towards a fold, especially since this is not a large pot. If the pot were larger and the board not so coordinated, a 3-bet might be in order.

Also, consider that the action is coming from the blinds in an unraised pot. They could have a number of hands that connect well with this board, whereas if the action was coming from early or middle position limpers you might be able to narrow down their range a little better.

All-in-all, I say it's a not-so-tough fold. If you later find out you would have won, no big deal in this small pot.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

[ QUOTE ]
depends on the table and players. Both are acceptable

edit - you do understand why limping sucks here, right?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because A9 is easily dominated and you have no idea what's coming behind you? I don't play suited aces UTG (usually) lower than ATs.

If you consider raising with this.. what's your strategy? Are you raising to thin the field and try to get rid of a MP ATo or something? Or do you want a big pot in case your diamonds hit on the flop?

Re: semi bluff raise
 

folding higher aces is one, , thinning the field is also good (possibly position), another is that if you limp this sh**I am going to isolate your ass everytime! You are about a 7.5:1 to flop a flush draw with two suited cards, so a many callers is not a terrible thing.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

Let's say everyone acting behind you is a passive preflop (0-3% PFR).. seems like a limp then to encourage more callers if you get your FD might not be a bad idea - if you can let it go if you don't hit big.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

what is their vpip

Re: semi bluff raise
 

Average micro LP fish. 35-70%

Re: semi bluff raise
 

I guess it depends how I well I can read them postflop. If they are closer to 70% than a call seems about in order (no chance of iso-raising) closer to 35% I'd say muck it, but there may be people who disagree with me on this one.

Re: semi bluff raise
 

Meh, raising is more fun and I don't care if a bunch of them call or if none of them call. I raise A9s+ UTG.

Edit: I'm talking about preflop

Re: semi bluff raise
 

I just don't see enough turn cards that make my 3 bet feel good here Tassie. Sure it's a top pair top kicker scenario, and you've got the opportunity to destroy the pot odds for the remainder of the field, but you will get at least two opponents going to the turn. I count 2 fine aces and two nines to improve. The non-club deuces, treys, and fours seem harmless. Everything else leaves you troubled and odds are everything else is a comin' on that turn. You're one small bet into this thing. Lay down and find a better investment. They're endless these days!!!

Re: semi bluff raise
 

[ QUOTE ]
Ditch this hand pre-flop from UTG. Problem solved.

Since you played it, I think this is a reraise or fold situation. With the texture of this flop I would lean towards a fold, especially since this is not a large pot. If the pot were larger and the board not so coordinated, a 3-bet might be in order.

Also, consider that the action is coming from the blinds in an unraised pot. They could have a number of hands that connect well with this board, whereas if the action was coming from early or middle position limpers you might be able to narrow down their range a little better.

All-in-all, I say it's a not-so-tough fold. If you later find out you would have won, no big deal in this small pot.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah. point taken. thanks

Re: semi bluff raise
 

If you tell me you are going to get 5 opponents to the flop with no raise, then I will limp with A9s UTG all day long.