Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

5 handed. The 2 Villains are regulars but wouldn't really know my game nor do I know theirs. I have been at table for about 5 minutes. I have 1k and they both cover.

CO raises to $33. Button calls. I raise out of the SB with K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] to $115. BB folds. CO and Button call.

Flop: pot=$355
3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

What is the plan from here? Bet size? Plan if raised?

I was thinking that a lot of hands have large equity against my hand and I am already behind AA, maybe 66 or 88 from button, and AK (maybe AQ of clubs) but think I am good here a big percentage of the time.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

Do you think that either of them are capable of semibluffing with the ace of clubs?

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

Bet 200, fold if raised.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

what if he bets 200 and is called?

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

"Bet 200, fold if raised."


I hope this is a joke.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

[ QUOTE ]
Bet 200, PUSH if raised.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYP

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

[ QUOTE ]
"Bet 200, fold if raised."


I hope this is a joke.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why is it a joke? OP showed great strength here preflop while 'value betting' the flop and I don't think a regular is going to raise him on this board without having him beat or in a coinflip situation. Hell, we are a coinflip to 3 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. If someone raises, it commits his whole stack. You say push but the stacks are nowhere deep enough to semibluff push since there would be ZERO fold equity. Even if the stacks were 200bb's, a push is suicidal. I hate playing for my whole stack in this situation where I may be drawing virtually dead or be ahead by very little. The only hands we are way ahead of are lower pairs without a [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and those hands will likely fold to his flop bet.

If one villian just calls and a brick comes on the turn, I push since a set and mid-flush would raise the flop which opens the possibility of 99c, 10 10c, JJc, QQc or Acx.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

How about calling a flop raise and then betting out on the turn if we like the card that comes off? The problem with your strategy of avoiding a coinflip is that by the time you want to fold there will be over 1k in the pot, meaning you need to be in much worse shape than flipping to fold.

Also, a push here will often be called by worse hands.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

[ QUOTE ]
How about calling a flop raise and then betting out on the turn if we like the card that comes off? The problem with your strategy of avoiding a coinflip is that by the time you want to fold there will be over 1k in the pot, meaning you need to be in much worse shape than flipping to fold.

Also, a push here will often be called by worse hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

I guess I am more interested in seeing what hand ranges you put Villain's on. Someone mentioned middle flush and I guess button could have suited connector since the CO had 1500 and he covered but I just don't see most players putting almost 10% of effective stacks without a PP or AKs/AQs/AKo. Therefore, I was reallly only worried about 88, or AK of clubs and AQ of clubs. Is this wrong, or is it that my hand is so well defined by my play that I give marginal drawing hands proper implied odds to call???

Anyways, after the fact I put my expected hand ranges into Pokerstove and I figured my hand will win at showdown 40% of the time. I also expect some worse hands to call even though they will have a lot of equity.

At the time I had myself convinced I was ahead but starting focusing on the ace of clubs and QQ or JJ with a club and decided to show a commitment to the pot, and potted it. Button raised me, and I just couldn't get away.

I still can't think of a line I like here. Button flopped non-nut flush, his hand is not important.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

[ QUOTE ]
I still can't think of a line I like here

[/ QUOTE ]

Bet 200, fold to a raise [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

[ QUOTE ]
How about calling a flop raise and then betting out on the turn

[/ QUOTE ]

Calling a flop raise will be all in.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

it makes me so happy that decent high stakes players get married to these weak non flush draw overpairs on these boards

dead money is quite apt

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

i think you bet 400 or dont bet at all.

turn if brick comes you obviously bet.

if players are TAG on flop then i prefer the lead. if laggy then check call. and fire in on brick turn.

but agreed with your stack betting 400 gets you to bet it all on any turn card non club but you save more if they flopped the flush by you checking.

so i guess i check call with your stack.

Re: Reraised KK OOP on a monotone flop 5/10
 

If you are Villain(s) and have one of these holdings what do you do when I bet 200?

Nut-flush
Non-nut fush
Set
AcAx
AxAx
AcKx
AxKc
AcQx
AxQc
AcXx
QxQc
QxQx
JxJc
Assumed all other PP's fold and ignore random junk although this will be a substantial %.

I see a mix of hands that will either raise or call there, some I am ahead, some I am pretty much dead. If I get called by one of these hands or a flopped flush and turn is a brick what do I do now? Lead again and fold to raise, check-fold, check-call?

I don't think this is as clear as saying bet 2/3 fold to raise and I also don't think this a case of "you are so dead money because you can't fold here". I didn't make a standard raise and see 5 limpers call. I made it almost 12% of my stack pre-flop.

That is my opinion and I was hoping, and still hoping to get some insights.