National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

My buyer at a certain major bookstore chain, has begun to give us substantially decreased orders for some poker magazines. He noted, "It is official, poker is the new Low Carb". By that he meant that the low carb craze in society came crashing down quickly early this years...and magazine sales seem to indicate it is heading in that direction.

MIND YOU, he is only talking about magazines...but it could perhaps be argued that magazines are a bell-weather of an item/comodity/national fixation.

Perhaps he is right, perhaps not--I have not had time to run the numbers. I tend to think the proliferation of titles on the market is more what we see at work than any general trend...but who knows, poker could well be on it's way 'out'.

---Leavenfish

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Nah

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Hi Fish:

You may be right but I suspect you're not. Some of us in the Two Plus Two organization were talking about this precise topic today. There are probably seven or eight of these magazines right now, and it seems as if each one has the very same articles. You get your Fossilman story, your Doyle story, your Negreanu story, your Annie Duke story, and so on. That may have something to do with a drop in interest in poker magazines.

In fact, my sources tell me that one of them (which had a booth at the WSOP) has already ceased publication. I suspect that several others will soon follow.

Best wishes,
Mason

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Come on Mason, youre being too modest. Why buy one of those magazines when we can read the 2+2 magazine for free right here with out cluttering up our home.

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

[ QUOTE ]
but it could perhaps be argued that magazines are a bell-weather of an item/comodity/national fixation.

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Poker for most players is a hobby and with most hobbies perhaps magazines would be a good barometer. But with poker you have the added twist of lots of high school and college age wannabes who would like to become pros. Every year you get a new influx. So what is/are the appropriate barometer(s) for poker? Not this site and its readers, because a base of winning players depends upon a larger base of losing ones who most likely don't read these forums regularly. But I think there are four accurate indicators: poker book sales, tournament TV ratings, site traffic on the major online sites, and the amount of space allocated in B&M casinos to poker. In fact in regards to the last one, since casinos have historically looked down upon poker and its comparatitvely small earnings compared to a bank of slots, then that is a very good indicator. And all 4 of those indicators still are positive.

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Levenfish's post did not clarify his role, he works for what is perhaps the largest magazine wholesale distributor in the country. He is in a unique position to spot trends, his input is valid.

On a related note, I visited B&N today. The number of poker magazines on display had dropped considerably since the last time I visited (although they could have been already sold, I had no friend at this store to verify) while the book section was the same size (allotment) but many of the titles that I would assume did not sell briskly had been removed to find space for the newer titles and books that seem to be mainstays. Interestingly enough only TOP & Gambling Theory & Other Topics was available, the location does a rather brisk 2+2 business from my past conversations with the manager.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Hi joker:

That's exactly right. None of these magazines are doing anything to distinguish themselves from any of the others. The only exception is our very own Internet magazine.

Best wishes,
Mason

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Well, like I said, I think it probably has more to do with the glut of magazines on the market than anything else. Each new title -- even if ultimately unsuccesful, canabalizes sales from others.

I think his remark comparing poker to the 'low carb' industry might be a bit premature--that really crashed with a thud! Still, it bares watching as I have seen a LOT of trends come and go which seemed to show up first in the magazine industry.

---Leavenfish

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

I think if you polled 2+2ers on their poker magazine purchases, you would find a large amount of people who bought a few poker magazines before realizing that they aren't worthwhile. Besides myself, I can think of a couple of other posters who had the same experience.

Seriously, its hard to see how bluff magazine or all in magazine presents good competition to cardplayer magazine. Cardplayer has the best writers, the force of tradition, and free online access. As for 2+2 internet magazine, I'm not sure that its in exactly the same market as bluff magazine &C0., despite its higher quality.

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Hi Snowball:

While I agree that we are not in the same market, we certainly put pressure on magazines like Bluff and All-in (and even Cardplayer). That's because readers will compare the quality of our articles to theirs and complain.

best wishes,
Mason

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Hi Fish:

One thing for sure. The poker explosion will eventually fade. The only questions are When? and How much?

best wishes,
Mason

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

I just don't know who the hell would by these poker/gambling lifestyle magazines. I opened one of these mags up with one of the lead actors in that crappy show Tilt; he was on the cover. I don't understand the demographic for this mag.

Poker definitely feels dot-com or low carbish. The interesting thing about it is that the bubble will most likely leave poker more popular than before it started. I know that before the surge in popularity, poker was often viewed by younger people as their "uncle's/dad's/etc. game."

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

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I just don't know who the hell would by these poker/gambling lifestyle magazines. I opened one of these mags up with one of the lead actors in that crappy show Tilt; he was on the cover. I don't understand the demographic for this mag.

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Exactly. I don't think these magazines failing shows that people have lost interest in poker. I think it shows that these magazines were terrible. When they first came out, people would buy an issue or two to give it a shot and then they realized how bad it is so they stopped buying.

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

I saw something very surprising when I visited a local bookstore (for New Yorkers-- it's the one on Prince off Mulbury and Lafyette, I think. I don't remember the name, it's not a big chain.) What used to be a robust poker section was small, picked over, and very bad. The rest of the store didn't seem to be in any kind of decline, so I didn't know what to make of this.

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I saw something very surprising when I visited a local bookstore (for New Yorkers-- it's the one on Prince off Mulbury and Lafyette, I think. I don't remember the name, it's not a big chain.) What used to be a robust poker section was small, picked over, and very bad. The rest of the store didn't seem to be in any kind of decline, so I didn't know what to make of this.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know the store you are speaking about (they sell a truckload of my magazine there), its where I buy most of my poker books. The store's initial stock was not ordered internally, it was provided by Ingram as a "starter kit" when they first opened. As their focus is mostly creative/book aficionados, their purchasing department has not made an effort to restock the category.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

I feel the poker boom and the popularity of poker will decline to some degree. There was a point where it had no where to go but down. I believe Chris Moneymaker said in a playboy interview a while back that he predicted the interest in poker to eventually decline. He stated that people would eventually get tired of watching the same hands race over and over at these final tables. To some degree, I think he was correct. Poker has saturated television to the point that even a poker enthusiast gets tired of seeing it. The bad poker coverage does not help either.

Also, people with high hopes of becoming the next millionaire, player of the year, or WPT champ quickly realized poker is not easy. They rushed out to buy books and videos to discover once more...poker is not easy.

Obviously, the people truly interested in poker and do well are not going anywhere. The WPT fans or the fans who show some interest during WSOP time eventually do fall off. I believe that's what we are seeing. ALLin and Bluff (horrible mag) tried to appeal to the general public and their love of the stars of the game. If you pick up a copy, you see there is not much to offer a serious player. Player bios and tournament coverage of the same poker you have seen all week loses its appeal over time.

I would say it will decline, but the interest levels will never drop below the pre-Moneymaker period. As new players discover they suck, new hotshot kids will take their place in line to try their own shot at glory.

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Fish:

One thing for sure. The poker explosion will eventually fade. The only questions are When? and How much?

best wishes,
Mason

[/ QUOTE ]


Any guesses on the answers? Fade like gasoline prices- to a higher level than before the boom? Or back to approximately the pre-boom levels?

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi joker:

That's exactly right. None of these magazines are doing anything to distinguish themselves from any of the others. The only exception is our very own Internet magazine.

Best wishes,
Mason

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Ill take it one step further it seems they all copied each other. I got about 6 different ones here I got from different casinos and they all have the same stuff on them.

Also the stuff they have is the type of articles the WSOP has had a player talk about on camera. Like for example Doyles life story, which was on the WSOP and on Beyond the Glory on Fox Sports Net, so theres even video version of this stuff.

The only ones that dont have the same stuff as all the others are Card Player and the 2+2 Magazine and thats why they are the only ones worth reading.

Also one other did try to separate itself from the pack though, Top Pair. It basically tried to combine poker with softcore porn. It still sucks cause the poker material is the same as the others so that sucks and the porn sucks. Overall it sucks at both. That is the only Magazine besides Card Player and the 2+2 Magazine that at least tried something different even if their idea was poorly executed.

Also Poker + Hardcore Porn would seem to be a winner.

I mean old people and kids in their late teens/early 20's play poker and they both have porn addictions. Im shocked someone hasnt done this.

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

Hi Jorge:

I understand that Top Pair is currently not publishing.

best wishes,
mason

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

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Also Poker + Hardcore Porn would seem to be a winner.

I mean old people and kids in their late teens/early 20's play poker and they both have porn addictions. Im shocked someone hasnt done this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sounds like a good idea. "Oh baby, show me your big hole...cards."

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Jorge:

I understand that Top Pair is currently not publishing.

best wishes,
mason

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They deserved that, the magazine was terrible. I just found their crazy idea to be extremely funny. I mean Poker + Softcore Porn. I didnt see that one coming ill say that much.

Re: National Poker Fixation On The Way Out?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi Jorge:

I understand that Top Pair is currently not publishing.

best wishes,
mason

[/ QUOTE ]

That magazine truly, truly sucked. No other way to put it.