2/4 KK right line?
 

Villain is fairly loose passive. His stats are somewhere around 28/1.5/0.8 I think this is the right way to play this hand.. what do you guys think?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $4 BB (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Button ($394.65)
SB ($376.50)
Hero ($467.15)
UTG ($360)
UTG+1 ($152)
MP1 ($1009.05)
MP2 ($100.20)
MP3 ($394.05)
CO ($469.35)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls $4, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, MP3 calls $4, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, SB completes, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $20</font>, UTG calls $16, MP3 calls $16, SB folds.

Flop: ($64) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $50</font>, UTG calls $50, MP3 folds.

Turn: ($164) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets $60</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $397.15</font>

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

if he is passive then why check this turn?

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

Just because he is passive doesn't mean that he'll never bet it.

I checked because I want him to think he's ahead.

Ryan

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

I like that line alot better when theres no flush draw. It'll suck if he checks behind and hits a flush. (or if he has 44 and hits a straight)

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just because he is passive doesn't mean that he'll never bet it.

I checked because I want him to think he's ahead.

Ryan

[/ QUOTE ]

So this line might get you a small bet out of a hand that would have folded to a turn lead.

However, on this board I think it makes it really obvious what you have and allows him to stack you if hes got you beat and get away cheap if he has a one pair/draw combo type hand.

Also, iceman brings up a good point, a smart player will check a flush behind there.

I would just lead the turn for slightly more than the pot.

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

If I'm leading turn for a little more than pot, shouldn't I just push?

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

I dont know why you need to overbet the pot here. I would make it $125

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

I like this line against an aggressive player, but not a passive one. I lead the turn for $125, making the draw(s) pay to stay in.

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

Ya, its an interesting line. Villan might call behind, and will call when ahead, but I think its better than just betting out again. That lets villan play better and not make a mistake. If you are making 2nd barrel bluffs, then you need to bet the turn, but if you are often betting flop, checkfolding turn then I like this line, it adds protection.

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

What about a check-call on the turn and a lead of about 1/2 to 2/3 of the pot on the river ?

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

[ QUOTE ]
What about a check-call on the turn and a lead of about 1/2 to 2/3 of the pot on the river ?

[/ QUOTE ]

I like this line when I can put my opponent squarely on one pair.

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

yeah, 125 is fine i guess i usually go somewhere between that and pot or slightly more.

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

I don't understand this line, and I don't consider those stats loose/passive. How many hands are we talking about here?
I think this is a great line if you want to get stacked ryan, otherwise I'd just lead this turn and continue to value bet with what is hopefully still the best hand. Why dump so much money hoping that he'll stack off with QQ-TT? Against a more aggresive opponent, perhaps this line would be alright, but for someoen that's passive, I'd say leading the turn is better.

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

I like the way you played it, did he fold or what?

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think this is a great line if you want to get stacked ryan, otherwise I'd just lead this turn and continue to value bet with what is hopefully still the best hand. Why dump so much money hoping that he'll stack off with QQ-TT? Against a more aggresive opponent, perhaps this line would be alright, but for someoen that's passive, I'd say leading the turn is better.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: 2/4 KK right line?
 

I don't play 10 man... but:

I'd raise more preflop, I pot it pretty much every time preflop.

Turn if hes passive I think there is a lot more value in betting out 3/4th-full pot on the turn. Checking-although deceptive, just seems unnecessary.

Results.
 

Villain called with 99 and MHIG. I suppose it is certainly risky to check but I have to wonder if the Villain would have ended up all-in if I'd just bet out the turn.

With cards this low, even though there are possible flush/straight draws out there, I have to put a loose Villain on an overpair. That's why I liked the check on this hand. I figured even though he was passive, he'd figure he was ahead on the turn and bet.

Ryan

Re: Results.
 

I don't really understand this line. In more aggressive and SH game - maybe. How often are we really getting called in this spot if we are ahead. And if we are getting called in this spot with certain frequency by, say, overpair, wouldn't we extract more value on average by just betting the turn here? (and lose less when behind)
Apparently a lot of people like this, so can somebody please explain merits of the turn play to me? Ignore the flush draw if you want (even though I suspect this line will be more successful with FD given that you do manage to CR all in)

Re: Results.
 

Wow....I really dont think 99 is calling this CR more than about 1/10.....that is a really bad play by him. But you are right, probably would have left him 100 or so if you had just bet-bet-bet. NH.