Re: Is B&M low limit waste of time?
 

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Haven't played much low-limit poker in vegas have you? I played an 8 hour session of 3/6 at the MGM and I saw a pot folded without a showdown 5 times. If you are playing standard 20/10 poker, you are only seeing 3 flops in 10 at most... and you are not winning 1/3 of those against 5-6 callers. Now when you DO win the pots are nice.. but 10% is not realistic unless you are playing something like 60-70% of hands. (and then your winrate is crap because you are putting money in with the worst of it to often)

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Why exactly do we need to win 10% of pots? It's not uncommon in these games for me to go up $80-$100 in one pot and then fold for a good half hour. The pots that I do win are so juiced by the 80% VPIP'ers and their obliviousness to when someone is trapping the field (for instance, I can't tell you how many times people will call an EP turn bet, but then fold to LP's "convincing" raise, basically putting a whole BB of dead money in).

Re: Is B&M low limit waste of time?
 

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Does your average 2+2er win 10% of pots?

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Pretty close. I run around 9%. And yes, the rake is almost always capped. 6 people to the flop is $18. 4 people to the turn = $30...max rake hit.

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Also consider that a better player will find better opportunities to take down pots with rags uncontested.

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Bhahahahahhaha! Oh, good one. *wipes tears from his eyes*. Ah, that was funny.

No pot goes uncontested at 3/6 live. Everything has at least one player who calls down. Usually multiple players. There is no picking up a pot through bluff. It's purely a value bet situation.

Re: Is B&M low limit waste of time?
 

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Does your average 2+2er win 10% of pots?

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Pretty close. I run around 9%.

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Really?!? What would you estimate your VPIP is? i'm amazed that you can do this if your VPIP is much lower than the other players at a 10 handed table (which it certainly should be in the games I play).

I'm playing closer attention to numbers other than my win-rate as a result of this thread. Small sample size I know, but last night I played 3 hours or about 100 hands winning a total of 5 pots (and one small side pot that basically made my money back on the hand). And it was a good session, with a profit of $135 at $3-6. That feels roughly typical and I seriously doubt I win more 5-6% of pots when playing 10 handed.

Re: Is B&M low limit waste of time?
 

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Does your average 2+2er win 10% of pots?

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Pretty close. I run around 9%.

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Really?!? What would you estimate your VPIP is? i'm amazed that you can do this if your VPIP is much lower than the other players at a 10 handed table (which it certainly should be in the games I play).

I'm playing closer attention to numbers other than my win-rate as a result of this thread. Small sample size I know, but last night I played 3 hours or about 100 hands winning a total of 5 pots (and one small side pot that basically made my money back on the hand). And it was a good session, with a profit of $135 at $3-6. That feels roughly typical and I seriously doubt I win more 5-6% of pots when playing 10 handed.

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That is about exactly where I find myself in these sessions... generally 1 small pot and 1 big pot. And I tend to lose 2-3 pots on the showdown when I run into a monster hand (often going check/check on the river when they have the nuts but are scared to bet "because I didn't know what you might have") So about 2 hands per 30 I win... And I probably see slightly over 10% of showdowns.

I do love the guy who has the nut straight and doesn't bet it on the river last to act. When I ask him why he didn't bet that "I didn't know what you might have, and I didn't want to lose anymore money"... DUDE! He had the freaking nuts! God I love those guys.

Re: Is B&M low limit waste of time?
 

10-handed, I'm a 18/9 or so. I win around 9% of the pots. While I enter fewer pots, I enter the ones I'm most likely to win. I'm also aggressive, so I win pots without a showdown.

Well, not just me, most TAGs have similar numbers. Most of the stats posts I've seen show similar numbers.

Re: Is B&M low limit waste of time?
 

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10-handed, I'm a 18/9 or so. I win around 9% of the pots. While I enter fewer pots, I enter the ones I'm most likely to win. I'm also aggressive, so I win pots without a showdown.

Well, not just me, most TAGs have similar numbers. Most of the stats posts I've seen show similar numbers.

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I might believe a solid image 18/9 TAG at 5/10 online could win 1/3 of the pots he plays in. But at 3/6 B&M you are seeing flops with 6-8 people in them and you are not beating 6-8 people 1/3 of the time consistently. And 6-8 people to the flop is exactly what you will see at 3/6 B&M... the cards just don't run that way. Pocket A's against 5 opponents is not much above a 33% win rate (I know it is 30% vs 10 players... so probably 45-50% win rate against 5 semi-nonrandom hands)

Re: Is B&M low limit waste of time?
 

I think so. Too much rake and costs.

Re: Is B&M low limit waste of time?
 

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BTW, 2 weeks ago I took about $800 off the tourists, locals and my friends playing 2-4 at Luxor over the weekend. It just depends [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

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I usually play $4/8 and I have made plenty of money doing so. One weekend a few months ago, I won almost $1,400 playing the game at the Trop. If you are at a table where people are sitting down w/ $2-300, money can be made. I've also sat down at table where everyone has less than $150 and it is much harder to win. Table selection is the key.