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Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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I believe the Bible to be 100% true, word for word. [/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] We've been through this in other threads. Those are easily explainable when placed in the proper context. [/ QUOTE ] I would be grateful if you could explain the following by 'placing them in the proper context': The number of beasts in the ark? Gen 7:2 “Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.” Gen 7:8 “Of clean beasts, and of beasts that are not clean, and of fowls, and of every thing that creepeth upon the earth, Gen 7:9 There went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded Noah.” How many languages? Gen 10:5, 20 & 31 There were many languages before the Tower of Babel. Gen 11:1 There was one language before the Tower of Babel. Not too good at Math? Gen 1:26 Terah was 70 years old when his son Abram was born. Gen 11:32 Terah was 205 years old when he died (making Abram 135). Gen 12:4 & Act 7:4 Abram was 75 when he left Haran, which was after his father died. 75!=135 David is which son? 1 Sam 16:10 and 11 David is the eighth son of Jesse. 1 Chr 2:13-15 David is the seventh son of Jesse. God is forgetful? Gen 15:9 & Exd 20:24 & 29:10-42 & Lev 1:1-7, 38 & Num 28:1-29, 40 God details sacrificial offerings. Jer 7:21-22 God denies detailing sacrificial offerings. Who is the Father-In-Law of Moses? Exo 3:1 Jethro was the Father-In-Law of Moses. Num 10:29 & Jud 4:11 Hobab was the Father-In-Law of Moses. Who is the father of Joseph? Mat 1:16 "And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ." Luk 3:23 "And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli." Judas died how? Mat 27:5 "And he cast down the pieces of silver into the temple and departed, and went out and hanged himself." Acts 1:18 "And falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all of his bowels gushed out." Jesus is confused? John 5:31 Jesus says, "If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true." John 8:18 Jesus says, "I am he that beareth witness of myself." What was the colour of the robe placed on Jesus during his trial? Mat 27:28 Scarlet John 19:2 Purple What did they give him to drink? Mat 27:34 Vinegar Mark 15:23 Wine with myrrh What was written on the sign on the cross? Mark 15:26 "And the superscription of his accusation was written over, THE KING OF THE JEWS." Mat 27:37 "And set up over his head his accusation written, THIS IS JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS." Luke 23:38 "And a superscription also was written over him in letters of Greek, and Latin, and Hebrew, THIS IS THE KING OF THE JEWS." John 19:19 "And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS." What were Jesus' last words? Mat 27:46,50 "And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, "Eli, eli, lama sabachthani?" that is to say, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" ...Jesus, when he cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost." Luke 23:46 "And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, "Father, unto thy hands I commend my spirit:" and having said thus, he gave up the ghost." John 19:30 "When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, "It is finished:" and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost." |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
That will keep them busy for a while. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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[ QUOTE ] I believe the Bible to be 100% true, word for word. [/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] We've been through this in other threads. Those are easily explainable when placed in the proper context. [/ QUOTE ] I would be grateful if you could explain the following by 'placing them in the proper context': The number of beasts in the ark? Gen 7:2 “Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.” Gen 7:8 “Of clean beasts, and of beasts that are not clean, and of fowls, and of every thing that creepeth upon the earth, Gen 7:9 There went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded Noah.” How many languages? Gen 10:5, 20 & 31 There were many languages before the Tower of Babel. Gen 11:1 There was one language before the Tower of Babel. Not too good at Math? Gen 1:26 Terah was 70 years old when his son Abram was born. Gen 11:32 Terah was 205 years old when he died (making Abram 135). Gen 12:4 & Act 7:4 Abram was 75 when he left Haran, which was after his father died. 75!=135 David is which son? 1 Sam 16:10 and 11 David is the eighth son of Jesse. 1 Chr 2:13-15 David is the seventh son of Jesse. God is forgetful? Gen 15:9 & Exd 20:24 & 29:10-42 & Lev 1:1-7, 38 & Num 28:1-29, 40 God details sacrificial offerings. Jer 7:21-22 God denies detailing sacrificial offerings. Who is the Father-In-Law of Moses? Exo 3:1 Jethro was the Father-In-Law of Moses. Num 10:29 & Jud 4:11 Hobab was the Father-In-Law of Moses. Who is the father of Joseph? Mat 1:16 "And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ." Luk 3:23 "And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli." Judas died how? Mat 27:5 "And he cast down the pieces of silver into the temple and departed, and went out and hanged himself." Acts 1:18 "And falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all of his bowels gushed out." Jesus is confused? John 5:31 Jesus says, "If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true." John 8:18 Jesus says, "I am he that beareth witness of myself." What was the colour of the robe placed on Jesus during his trial? Mat 27:28 Scarlet John 19:2 Purple What did they give him to drink? Mat 27:34 Vinegar Mark 15:23 Wine with myrrh What was written on the sign on the cross? Mark 15:26 "And the superscription of his accusation was written over, THE KING OF THE JEWS." Mat 27:37 "And set up over his head his accusation written, THIS IS JESUS THE KING OF THE JEWS." Luke 23:38 "And a superscription also was written over him in letters of Greek, and Latin, and Hebrew, THIS IS THE KING OF THE JEWS." John 19:19 "And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS." What were Jesus' last words? Mat 27:46,50 "And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, "Eli, eli, lama sabachthani?" that is to say, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" ...Jesus, when he cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost." Luke 23:46 "And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, "Father, unto thy hands I commend my spirit:" and having said thus, he gave up the ghost." John 19:30 "When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, "It is finished:" and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost." [/ QUOTE ] I'm leaving town shortly and don't have the time to answer each one of these individually. However, you can find the answers to all these and more at http://www.tektonics.org/ Use the "Apolgetics Encyclopedia" at the top left. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Your including Jews, Muslims, Mormons and Hindus in this I assume. [/ QUOTE ] I don't include anyone. The Bible states that every human being has sinned and needs salvation. That includes Catholics and Protestants. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Why has NotReady ignored this post? It's by far the most interesting one in the thread. (Not surprising considering its inspiration! Nietzsche = teh pwn.) [/ QUOTE ] Tell me the historical facts upon which Nietzsche bases his claim - the people, location and time range - and I will comment for you. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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I'm leaving town shortly and don't have the time to answer each one of these individually. However, you can find the answers to all these and more at http://www.tektonics.org/ Use the "Apolgetics Encyclopedia" at the top left. [/ QUOTE ] Thank you for that link. I have not seen that website, or come across the technique of 'harmonization', before and found it very interesting. I won't answer all of the 'harmonizations' individually as the general technique can be summed up and debunked: 1. Bible has contradiction where it says A in one place and B in another. 2. 'Harmonization' says that A is in fact equal to B or that a 'harmonious' C can be formed by joining A and B. Unfortunately the suspension of logic and rationality required to equate A to B or join them together to form C is ridiculous. For example, they harmonize the differing numbers of beasts entering the ark as follows: [ QUOTE ] The answer is, seven. The phrase "two by two" in 7:9 simply means the animals entered the ark in pairs. So the beasts with 7 representatives came in as 3 pairs and 1 oddball each, paired off male and female and one spare wheel. [/ QUOTE ] The idea of three pairs and one 'oddball' is not from the Bible, it is something they have conjured out of thin air in a desperate attempt to smash a round peg into a square hole. They use similar techniques of fabrication, misdirection, and ignorance of Occam's Razor in all of their 'harmonizations'. I would suggest that it is very difficult to have a worthwhile discussion with someone who truly believes that these intellectually dishonest maneuverings are valid rebuttals to the obvious mistakes and contradictions in the Bible. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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The idea of three pairs and one 'oddball' is not from the Bible [/ QUOTE ] From another site: [ QUOTE ] Genesis 6:19-20 simply instructs Noah to preserve two of every kind. Genesis 7:2-3 is additional information where seven of the clean animals were to be taken and two of every other kind. [/ QUOTE ] God was simply providing clean animals for the purpose of animal sacrifice, perhaps also for food. This is just another manufactured contradiction. If you think about it for more than 2 seconds, this "obvious" contradiction occurred within the space of a few verses. Any 6th grader who might write this would see the difference between 7 and 2. It takes someone thinking below the level of 6th grade to imagine a contradiction here. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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God was simply providing clean animals for the purpose of animal sacrifice, perhaps also for food. This is just another manufactured contradiction. [/ QUOTE ] I'm not sure God 'simply' provided anything, as she seemed to seriously confuse the authors of Genesis: Genesis 6:19 "And of every living thing of all flesh, two of every sort shalt thou bring into the ark, to keep them alive with thee; they shall be male and female." Very specific about there only being two of 'every living thing'. Genesis 7:2 "Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female." According to your quoted site this adds 'additional information' that there should actually be seven of every clean beast, overriding the 'every living thing' mistake of 6:19. Dubious considering the explicit language used in 6:19, but we'll cut the idea some slack. Genesis 7:8+9 "Of clean beasts, and of beasts that are not clean, and of fowls, and of every thing that creepeth upon the earth, there went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female," Specifically mentions both clean and unclean beasts going in 'two and two', with no mention of seven at all. Whoops! Forget what they said in 7:2, they actually got it right in the first place in 6:19. Or hang on, maybe the seven went in "two and two... errr and two, errr and one 'oddball'"?! You have yet to demonstrate to me how this is a 'manufactured contradiction'. [ QUOTE ] If you think about it for more than 2 seconds, this "obvious" contradiction occurred within the space of a few verses. Any 6th grader who might write this would see the difference between 7 and 2. [/ QUOTE ] You would think so, wouldn't you? Though obviously it wasn't that clear to the authors of Genesis. (Before you say that Moses wrote Genesis please read Who Wrote The Bible? Friedman, 1997.) [ QUOTE ] It takes someone thinking below the level of 6th grade to imagine a contradiction here. [/ QUOTE ] Nice. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Very specific about there only being two of 'every living thing'. [/ QUOTE ] Where does it say only? [ QUOTE ] According to your quoted site this adds 'additional information' that there should actually be seven of every clean beast, overriding the 'every living thing' mistake of 6:19. [/ QUOTE ] Why is that an override? [ QUOTE ] Specifically mentions both clean and unclean beasts going in 'two and two', with no mention of seven at all. Whoops! Forget what they said in 7:2, they actually got it right in the first place in 6:19. Or hang on, maybe the seven went in "two and two... errr and two, errr and one 'oddball'"? [/ QUOTE ] They went in in pairs. What a mystery. Yeah, you just overthrew 5000 years of Judaism and Christianity. Nobody ever thought of this before. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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[ QUOTE ] Specifically mentions both clean and unclean beasts going in 'two and two', with no mention of seven at all. Whoops! Forget what they said in 7:2, they actually got it right in the first place in 6:19. Or hang on, maybe the seven went in "two and two... errr and two, errr and one 'oddball'"? [/ QUOTE ] They went in in pairs. What a mystery. [/ QUOTE ] http://www.thebricktestament.com/gen...gn07_01-02.jpg (formerly kidluckee, somehow I got banned) |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Yeah, you just overthrew 5000 years of Judaism and Christianity. Nobody ever thought of this before. [/ QUOTE ] Interesting choice, "overthrew". I think we may be getting to the bottom of this. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
You got banned? Must have been your "warm and fuzzy" comments. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
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Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Where does it say only? [/ QUOTE ] In the English language when you are talking about a specific number of objects, unless you explicitly state otherwise, you mean only that number. For example, if I were to tell you that I wanted you to take two cats into your car, I hope you would understand that I don't want you to take one, or three, or ten cats - only two. [ QUOTE ] Why is that an override? [/ QUOTE ] I feel like I'm teaching you basic English here. When you give someone an instruction and then give 'additional information' that renders the original instruction invalid you have overridden it. For example, if I were to tell you that I wanted you to take two cats into your car, but later I said I actually wanted you to take seven white cats and two black cats, the new instruction has overridden the original instruction. [ QUOTE ] They went in in pairs. What a mystery. [/ QUOTE ] It certainly is a mystery how seven beasts can go in pairs. This is why that site you quoted had to conjure up the 'spare wheel' beast. Sarcasm and hand waving is not helping you demonstrate how this isn't a contradiction. [ QUOTE ] Yeah, you just overthrew 5000 years of Judaism and Christianity. Nobody ever thought of this before. [/ QUOTE ] I'm not claiming originality here, many people have thought of this before. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Genesis 6:19 "And of every living thing of all flesh, two of every sort shalt thou bring into the ark, to keep them alive with thee; they shall be male and female." Very specific about there only being two of 'every living thing'. In the English language when you are talking about a specific number of objects, unless you explicitly state otherwise, you mean only that number. For example, if I were to tell you that I wanted you to take two cats into your car, I hope you would understand that I don't want you to take one, or three, or ten cats - only two. [/ QUOTE ] You see the word only there because you want to, not because it's there. The pupose for bringing two is given in the verse - to keep them alive. Just in passing, in case you weren't aware, the Bible wasn't written in English. And yes, that does matter. If you don't take the time to understand something about the Hebrew language you're going to come with any number of errors and contradictions that are just idiomatic Hebrew. I can't wait. [ QUOTE ] and th en give 'additional information' that renders the original instruction invalid [/ QUOTE ] This begs the question. Why did it render it invalid. I feel like I'm teaching basic Hebrew here. [ QUOTE ] It certainly is a mystery how seven beasts can go in pairs. [/ QUOTE ] Genesis 7:2 "Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female." Seven pairs of beast. Two by two. Get it now? |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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I would suggest that it is very difficult to have a worthwhile discussion with someone who truly believes that these intellectually dishonest maneuverings are valid rebuttals to the obvious mistakes and contradictions in the Bible. [/ QUOTE ] What you call "intellectually dishonest maneuverings" often involve researching the original Hebrew and Greek, comparing what is found with common literary techniques of time period in which the text in question was composed in order to come to the most accurate understanding possible. What is, in fact, intellectually dishonest is to lump everything into one inaccurate representation and present it to the readers of this forum as fact. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
Wow, debating Noah's ark?
ok, here's my argument. *ahem* You. Can't. Fit. Every. Species. On. One. [censored]. BOAT!!!! |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Wow, debating Noah's ark? ok, here's my argument. *ahem* You. Can't. Fit. Every. Species. On. One. [censored]. BOAT!!!! [/ QUOTE ] Q.E.D. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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You see the word only there because you want to, not because it's there. The pupose for bringing two is given in the verse - to keep them alive. [/ QUOTE ] We were not discussing the purpose for bringing two, we were discussing that the wording of the verse makes it clear that only two of each beast are to be brought. My point stands even without the word only there so we can drop this irrelevant side issue, which I am obviously not explaining well. [ QUOTE ] If you don't take the time to understand something about the Hebrew language you're going to come with any number of errors and contradictions that are just idiomatic Hebrew. [/ QUOTE ] I agree that human errors will occur during translation. I didn't realise you shared my view there are 'any number of errors and contradictions' in the English version of the Bible. [ QUOTE ] This begs the question. Why did it render it invalid. [/ QUOTE ] So now you're happy with the concept that a new instruction can override an original? But you want me to explain how this is analogous to rendering it invalid? I'm sorry, but I'm growing a little tired of giving English lessons, please refer to a dictionary if you seriously don't understand this concept. [ QUOTE ] I feel like I'm teaching basic Hebrew here. [/ QUOTE ] You've lost me with this. [ QUOTE ] Seven pairs of beast. Two by two. Get it now? [/ QUOTE ] The 'harmonization' website txag007 linked to disagrees with you Tektonics: [ QUOTE ] Were there seven of each clean beast, or two? The answer is, seven. The phrase "two by two" in 7:9 simply means the animals entered the ark in pairs. So the beasts with 7 representatives came in as 3 pairs and 1 oddball each, paired off male and female and one spare wheel. [/ QUOTE ] Have the 'harmonization' experts got it wrong? |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Wow, debating Noah's ark? ok, here's my argument. *ahem* You. Can't. Fit. Every. Species. On. One. [censored]. BOAT!!!! [/ QUOTE ] http://www.answersingenesis.org/home.../arksize13.asp |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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What you call "intellectually dishonest maneuverings" often involve researching the original Hebrew and Greek, comparing what is found with common literary techniques of time period in which the text in question was composed in order to come to the most accurate understanding possible. [/ QUOTE ] Unfortunately it is possible to use common research techniques and still arrive at spurious conclusions through poor reasoning. [ QUOTE ] What is, in fact, intellectually dishonest is to lump everything into one inaccurate representation and present it to the readers of this forum as fact. [/ QUOTE ] I will admit that I may have oversimplified their technique in the interests of making a point, and to keep my post from becoming an essay. I apologize if you feel I misrepresented them. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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[ QUOTE ] Wow, debating Noah's ark? ok, here's my argument. *ahem* You. Can't. Fit. Every. Species. On. One. [censored]. BOAT!!!! [/ QUOTE ] http://www.answersingenesis.org/home.../arksize13.asp [/ QUOTE ] Comedy gold. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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We were not discussing the purpose for bringing two, we were discussing that the wording of the verse makes it clear that only two of each beast are to be brought. [/ QUOTE ] Where does it say only? [ QUOTE ] I didn't realise you shared my view there are 'any number of errors and contradictions' in the English version of the Bible. [/ QUOTE ] Which English version did you think I believe is inerrant? You make a lot of assumptions. Why not just assume I believe the Swahili version is inerrant? Then you can find even more contradictions. [ QUOTE ] I'm sorry, but I'm growing a little tired of giving English lessons, please refer to a dictionary if you seriously don't understand this concept. [/ QUOTE ] I will as soon as you understand the concept that two compatible commands don't contradict each other. [ QUOTE ] Have the 'harmonization' experts got it wrong? [/ QUOTE ] This will be relevant when I state that tektonics is infallible. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
"if God in His wisdom decided not to preserve some ocean creatures, this was none of Noah’s business."
For some reason, I loved that sentence. I can see God ticking off his list, thinking, "No, that one has too many bones, he's out. But seahorses are pretty cool, some of my best work. We'll keep them." Anyway, how did Noah go about collecting all the animals that were on the ark? Did he post advertising, promising door prizes to those who made the trip? Re David's dinosaur question: Your link talks about saving the dinosaurs, since their eggs were relatively small. So, I repeat the question he asked: Were there humans and dinosaurs living at the same time? |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Re David's dinosaur question: Your link talks about saving the dinosaurs, since their eggs were relatively small. So, I repeat the question he asked: Were there humans and dinosaurs living at the same time? [/ QUOTE ] NotReady had a great response elsewhere in this thread that, quite honestly, also applies here: That will be relevent when I declare www.answersingenesis.org to be infallible. The point being that my link gave a reasonable answer as how the animals could have fit on the ark, which was the original question. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Where does it say only? [/ QUOTE ] You are not reading what I am writing. Unfortunately as this is our only form of communication, I fear our discussion is in some trouble. [ QUOTE ] Which English version did you think I believe is inerrant? [/ QUOTE ] I would hope you realize that none of them are inerrant. [ QUOTE ] I will as soon as you understand the concept that two compatible commands don't contradict each other. [/ QUOTE ] I'm sorry that I have to repeat myself, but you have not shown how the two commands are compatible. In fact your whole argument thus far seems to be based solely on picking apart my use of the English language. [ QUOTE ] Have the 'harmonization' experts got it wrong? [ QUOTE ] This will be relevant when I state that tektonics is infallible. [/ QUOTE ] [/ QUOTE ] This is directly relevant to our discussion, as it shows not even Christians agree on the meaning of the verse. It proves that the issue is not as simple as you implied in your post: [ QUOTE ] Seven pairs of beast. Two by two. Get it now? [/ QUOTE ] |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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I'm sorry that I have to repeat myself, but you have not shown how the two commands are compatible. [/ QUOTE ] Two of each kind for preservation. Seven pairs of clean for sacrifice and possible food. Simple. [ QUOTE ] as it shows not even Christians agree on the meaning of the verse. [/ QUOTE ] If you require full agreement among all Christians on every verse of the Bible and every doctrine, you win. Others can decide how fair such a requirement is. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Wow, debating Noah's ark? ok, here's my argument. *ahem* You. Can't. Fit. Every. Species. On. One. [censored]. BOAT!!!! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.answersingenesis.org/home.../arksize13.asp [/ QUOTE ] txag007, if you were looking for evidence against Christianity, then there you have it. Unless you can come up with a better defense against the preposterous claims of the Noah's ark story than the link you provided, I'd call this case closed. Any anthropologist, zoologist, botanist or any scientist that still thought this could explain things (even accounting for animal babies and later offshoots of more specific species) would be laughed out of his job if we didn't indulge religious lunacy for PC reasons. A fifth grader, even following this link's absurd guidelines, could still disprove this story with one visit to a zoo and a measuring tape, pencil, and a paper. So there is your evidence against Christianity. At least as far as a literal interpretation of the Bible goes. I don't expect you to agree with me. It is just that your 100% belief in a literal interpretation of the Bible is diametrically opposed to my 100% disbelief in the possibility of such a literal interpretation being true. I don't know how I'm ever going to convince you of the truth. You probably feel likewise. So we spin our wheels. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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A fifth grader, even following this link's absurd guidelines, could still disprove this story with one visit to a zoo and a measuring tape, pencil, and a paper. So there is your evidence against Christianity. At least as far as a literal interpretation of the Bible goes. [/ QUOTE ] While it's easy to make statements like the one you just posted, I did notice that you haven't done the calculations yourself. If a fifth grader could do it, surely you can too. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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The point being that my link gave a reasonable answer as how the animals could have fit on the ark, which was the original question. [/ QUOTE ] A "reasonable explanation" should satisfy the scientific/secular paradigm that the atheistic audience whom you're addressing holds...otherwise there would be no reason because you can revert to "everything is possible with God." A "reasonable explanation" is not one that can be provided by a couple half-wits on that website; it would require a team of anthropologists, engineers, zoologists and strategists to explain how Noah, a guy with stone-age technology, could build a boat half the length of the Titanic, round up two of every non-sea dwelling species on earth, and accomodate them with food, air, pooping facilities (for lack of a better term) in this massive, gopher-wood ark, with adequate living accomodations for seven months...AND maintain them such a manner that they all lived. The scientific/practical problems with this are far too numerous to even be worth listing. Noah could NOT have been able to do this without some incredibly divine intervention, and if we're willing to accept divine intervention, then there is no reason for people to be arguing how someone could pull this ridiculous feat off. Please accept that you want us to believe something that IS completely and utterly impossible short of divine intervention, and stop making yourself look like an idiot. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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[ QUOTE ] The point being that my link gave a reasonable answer as how the animals could have fit on the ark, which was the original question. [/ QUOTE ] A "reasonable explanation" should satisfy the scientific/secular paradigm that the atheistic audience whom you're addressing holds...otherwise there would be no reason because you can revert to "everything is possible with God." A "reasonable explanation" is not one that can be provided by a couple half-wits on that website; it would require a team of anthropologists, engineers, zoologists and strategists to explain how Noah, a guy with stone-age technology, could build a boat half the length of the Titanic, round up two of every non-sea dwelling species on earth, and accomodate them with food, air, pooping facilities (for lack of a better term) in this massive, gopher-wood ark, with adequate living accomodations for seven months...AND maintain them such a manner that they all lived. The scientific/practical problems with this are far too numerous to even be worth listing. Noah could NOT have been able to do this without some incredibly divine intervention, and if we're willing to accept divine intervention, then there is no reason for people to be arguing how someone could pull this ridiculous feat off. Please accept that you want us to believe something that IS completely and utterly impossible short of divine intervention, and stop making yourself look like an idiot. [/ QUOTE ] I never said that divine intervention wasn't possible. What I said was that the Bible is true, word for word. This means that Noah built the ark and put the animals inside. It does not mean that God didn't help Noah. If you are telling me, however, that it was impossible to build the ark based on the technology of Noah's time, you're wrong. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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If you are telling me, however, that it was impossible to build the ark based on the technology of Noah's time, you're wrong. [/ QUOTE ] Are you trying to tell me that this amazing feat of engineering was possible without divine intervention? If yes, I won't dignify your answer with a response. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
If the Bible is true, word for word, then who found Jesus' tomb empty?
Specifically. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
I just checked all of Not Ready's posts in this thread, and I didn't see an answer to the question. It's a question that can be answered in one word: Do you believe that there were humans living on the planet at the same time that dinosaurs were? Yes or no?
Thanks. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
according to the Bible the flood" became so deep that it covered the highest mountains" thereby the flood covered mount Everest. Mount Everest is 8km high, so we basically need a lot of water.
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Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
txa, I've got a question regarding the ark. Did the flood indeed cover the entire earth, so that all humans and land based mammals now living descend from those on the ark?
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Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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I just checked all of Not Ready's posts in this thread [/ QUOTE ] I don't recall commenting one way or the other or being requested to. Since you ask: How do you define dinosaur? Clearly their relatives(reptiles or birds, I don't think science has completely settled this yet) are alive today and most likely were pre-flood. If you mean trex, I don't know and the Bible doesn't say. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
Is the reason you don't know because the bible doesn't say? Or is it because you merely have never read scientific determininations of the dates when trex walked the earth versus the earliest examples of ho.mo sapiens? Or is it because you reject those scientific determinations because they conflict with your interpretation of the bible though you can't explain it any other way?
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Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
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txa, I've got a question regarding the ark. Did the flood indeed cover the entire earth, so that all humans and land based mammals now living descend from those on the ark? [/ QUOTE ] I'm not sure, BluffThis. Common belief is that it did indeed cover the whole Earth, but there is also a convincing Biblical argument that it was a local flood. |
Re: Evidence AGAINST Christianity
Science can easily supply the answer as to the proper biblical interpretation through genetics and mathematical models of population growth.
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