Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

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we need to form a union. We would look after our interests and not profit from other player's rake. We should seriously consider doing this.

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OK, so what would a player's union do exactly? And how would it be funded?

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well, for one we could create a private forum that caters to players needs (ie no ads, no spam, REAL open discussion)

we could form our own rakeback where the absolute smallest amount is taken off the top to pay for expensess/whatever (no affiliates getting rich off us)

we could potentially have power in numbers which could give us barganing/deal making power w/ poker sites.

All this is just an idea now, but i would like to see somehting like this happen.

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

A group of players could create a nonprofit or co-op that plays the role of the affiliate. Someone still has to do the work, but the tables would be turned, sort of.

edit: If the organization were large enough, it could negotiate with the sites directly, independent of the affiliate-based marketing system.

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

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we need to form a union. We would look after our interests and not profit from other player's rake. We should seriously consider doing this.

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OK, so what would a player's union do exactly? And how would it be funded?

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well, for one we could create a private forum that caters to players needs (ie no ads, no spam, REAL open discussion)

we could form our own rakeback where the absolute smallest amount is taken off the top to pay for expensess/whatever (no affiliates getting rich off us)

we could potentially have power in numbers which could give us barganing/deal making power w/ poker sites.

All this is just an idea now, but i would like to see somehting like this happen.

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you guys have NO IDEA!@$~!%#^$&%^*%i&^$#@%!#@$

this is exactly how i started as an affiliate. my buddies and i thought it was cool to get something back at the end of each month for our player. blah blah, over time we grew and grew. then i joined up with morg, and boom! raketracker was out. at that time our user base was huge, and in the past year we only continued to grow. now we have something like 4 or 5,000 players.

anyway, we are like a union... you guys have no idea how hard we fight for you. trying to get you the best %s, trying to get you bonuses, adding games / other options that our users ask. i wish i could list the stuff i have done for my players... everyone just takes it for granted.

im sorry this is not a rant, im just sick of ppl thinking affiliates are lairs/scumbags based on the actions of 1 or 2 affiliates.

i work about 8-10 hours a day 7 days a week on this affiliate stuff. yes, i get paid well, but its work. nothing is free! i just need a hug

bye, ryan

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

the point of said union would not be strictly rake related. Also the point of it would be that affiliates would NOT be well paid. If it was set up corectly, not much work would be involved and i would be willing to donate my time to it (and im sure others would too)

im not saying your evil and greedy, or that any other specific affiliate is. But they way it works now is that you have to have money to make money, and its at the expense of the player too often.

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

First my disclaimer, I'm a small affiliate who worked at one site, where I also played, for the past year.
Most of rakeback affiliates being whores is not an intelligent, informed opinion and the idea of a union is exactly what they represent. Why call them names for taking a couple percent off the top when they get an individual player more than he could ever get on his own? There are plenty of instances of crooks or affiliates that aren't looking out for their players, but you would need to illustrate these examples specifically against the large group of affiliates that do good business.
This is a paid forum and difficult sometimes to have a forthright discussion about rakeback, but any attempt to do so that I've seen is with the player's interests in mind. That is just good business. And you insult them for it? Players looking for answers that cannot be provided here won't have much difficulty getting them answered elsewhere, if they choose to look.

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

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the point of said union would not be strictly rake related. Also the point of it would be that affiliates would NOT be well paid. If it was set up corectly, not much work would be involved and i would be willing to donate my time to it (and im sure others would too)

im not saying your evil and greedy, or that any other specific affiliate is. But they way it works now is that you have to have money to make money, and its at the expense of the player too often.

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no matter how you handle it, its a LOT of work. someone is going to have to do that work, and he should be paid for it.

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

i think that you are biasd, being a "well-payed" affil.

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

Players' union is a loaded word. This indicates the group would need a public relations expert, so they don't get bad "spin," and a professional negotiator to be able to bargain with the site owners.

Liability for anything reaffirms that any group needs an attorney.

Money to be handled cries out for a real accountant.

Of course until the group reaches a critical mass, you don't really need full time people, but you do need customer service support and programmers to run any organization.

There are other jobs to be done. While the per person cost isn't very high, you will need more people for every couple hundred members.

Because poker players are not going to "pay" for the service if it comes out of their pockets, it has to be paid by someone else who makes a profit, and that is where the affiliates come in. Be honest, even if you knew you were saving $200 bucks a month, would you really pay $49.95 up front to be a member?

So who do you think is going to be poised to pull off a player group? Who has the long term knowledge, the business sense, and the contacts? Surprisingly there are quite a few knowledgeable people who love poker, because the job isn't going to be an easy one!

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

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we need to form a union. We would look after our interests and not profit from other player's rake. We should seriously consider doing this.

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It's not incentive compatible so it wouldn't work.

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Yeah, basically we can't shut ourselves down, because whoever stays behind on a site is going to have AWESOME games... prisoners dilema, and everyone stays and gets shafted equally. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

However, one thing that was suggested, when party raised the rake on 6-max games, was that everyone could sit at a 6-max table and just not play, so that the games were 5-max at the lower rake.

This might have given party a clear idea of what was involved in [censored] over their players. I said I'd do it, no one supported it.

--Dave.

Re: What a Lot of Rakeback Affiliates Look Like To Me
 

can i please be jimmy hoffa?

before he was killed