Re: KJs HU OOP on turn and river
 

Check and fold. On a more interesting flop (like A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]) you could check and call the river. Hand looks good up to this point though.

Brad

Re: KJs HU OOP on turn and river
 

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With at most three players in the pot, how often do you expect to get to the showdown?

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More often than I'd like. And being out of position gives me less control over this.

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That's not very helpful. You don't express how often you would like to get to the showdown, so you didn't even answer the question.

Re: KJs HU OOP on turn and river
 

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That's not very helpful. You don't express how often you would like to get to the showdown, so you didn't even answer the question.

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My point was that having a hand with showdown value gives you more options on the river than just check-fold, which seems to be the consensus here.

Re: KJs HU OOP on turn and river
 

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That's not very helpful. You don't express how often you would like to get to the showdown, so you didn't even answer the question.

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My point was that having a hand with showdown value gives you more options on the river than just check-fold, which seems to be the consensus here.

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Your reasoning for not raising preflop based on that single idea is very narrow-minded.

Re: KJs HU OOP on turn and river
 

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Your reasoning for not raising preflop based on that single idea is very narrow-minded.

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A better way to express my reason for not raising is that I don't like to build big pots out of position when I very likely do not have the best hand and I will very often be forced to conceed the hand without that much resistance from my opponent even if I am best.

Re: KJs HU OOP on turn and river
 

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Your reasoning for not raising preflop based on that single idea is very narrow-minded.

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A better way to express my reason for not raising is that I don't like to build big pots out of position when I very likely do not have the best hand and I will very often be forced to conceed the hand without that much resistance from my opponent even if I am best.

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What about when you're not building a big pot and you do have the best hand?

Rob

Re: KJs HU OOP on turn and river
 

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Your reasoning for not raising preflop based on that single idea is very narrow-minded.

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A better way to express my reason for not raising is that I don't like to build big pots out of position when I very likely do not have the best hand and I will very often be forced to conceed the hand without that much resistance from my opponent even if I am best.

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Again, you're making a very weak point. "Big pot" in this case is 6 SB (when BB comes along, and only 5 SB if he folds), which is not very big (consider that only two more limpers makes this pot 5 SB if you complete your blind). Your claim that you "very likely do not have the best hand" is dubious (you're losing to A-high, a pocket pair, and KQ... and all you have at your very first action is a limper UTG+1). Your description of postflop play is vague and represents a fit-or-fold postflop mentality.

Results
 

I check-folded, and villain flashed his cards before mucking (at Paradise, you have the option. I don't know if other sites do that).

Paradise Poker 1/2 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (6 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (4 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG+1 calls.

River: (6 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG+1 bets</font>, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 7 BB

Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF">
UTG+1 has 4c 6c (one pair, aces).
Outcome: UTG+1 wins 7 BB. </font>

Did he outplay me? [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

Perhaps, but anyone who limps UTG+1 with that is okay by me. I had my money on him holding a weak ace, QJ, QT, or a medium pocket pair. And I lost.

Re: Results
 

i knew it. i knew you should've check called. knew it all along.

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Did he outplay me?

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he made a good bet and you made a good fold.

Re: Results
 

At least you can bust out your river check-raise next time!!