Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

Fire a letter off to the casino manager. Heck, maybe the floor is in on it. If you're not gonna go back, take the whole place down.

No, I don't think the floor is in on it, but by your assertation that he knows one of the colluders, that's obviously influenced his decision.

Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

Only possibly because you know the guy is going to raise with any hand that he has. So if you have anything that's playable re-raise him.

If these guys are in every single hand it's even better. You just treat them like any other maniac, unfortuanlly your odds are down though because there are more than one of them so your varience will no doubt go thru the roof.

(which may be a good reason to complain anyway)

Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

It's 2/4, what are they going to buy at Wendy's a frosty???

Ive seen better at Potty that was close to collusion, but came to this conclusion anyway. It's not like these guys have this grandmaster plan to get rich and steal people's money, it's just the case of a couple buddys who are unfortuanlly sitting right next to each other who are screwing around and taking advantage of the situation.

But still, you know they are doing it so it's not that hard to take advantage of the situation yourself. Just change seats to get on their left as soon as you can, and try to isolate them and watch your varience go thru the roof.

Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

[ QUOTE ]
3) It's a kill pot. Before the cards are dealt, the leader of their group whispers to the guy on his right (one of his friends) to 'bump it up'. Leader, who is UTG, raises, his friend to his right re-raises.


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His friend is in the big blind, right? Were there callers in between? It's not collusion to agree to raise or 3-bet without looking at your cards. The other two examples you gave, if they're not "jokes", are examples of team play or collusion.

Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
3) It's a kill pot. Before the cards are dealt, the leader of their group whispers to the guy on his right (one of his friends) to 'bump it up'. Leader, who is UTG, raises, his friend to his right re-raises.


[/ QUOTE ]
His friend is in the big blind, right? Were there callers in between? It's not collusion to agree to raise or 3-bet without looking at your cards. The other two examples you gave, if they're not "jokes", are examples of team play or collusion.

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Sorry, I tried fixing my OP, but it was too late. The guy who said to bump it up was UTG, his friend was directly to his LEFT. The kill was on the button.

As I said, this was the final incident of the night. First, there was the comment about giving him a signal if one of his friends had a good hand. Then, they were asking each other if they were going to call my river bet. Finally, the obvious betting and raising to get other players out of pots, followed by a single river bet and a muck. They were obviously trying to buy the kill pot for the team. And if someone had a playable hand, they would team up against them.

Look, just because I know the way to combat this stuff does not make it right. And it certainly doesn't mean that the floor should let them get away with it. FWIW, I left the casino up $ for my session, but that's not the point. Poker is not supposed to be a team sport.

Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

The problem is NON PROFESSIONAL MIDWEST POKER ROOMS. Those rooms in NW Indiana, and Aurora are horrible. Card rooms which accomodate THOUSANDS of players EVERY month, are run much better. Those eight, twelve, or seventeen table rooms are the PITS.
[img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]


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Anyway, this happened to me the other day at Potowatomi in Milwaukee.

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Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

[ QUOTE ]
and that the guy who said to raise it up used as an excuse the fact that he did it before the cards were dealt. He didn't even deny telling his friend to raise pre-flop!

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This is really the only thing that stood out in the OP that wouldn't have bothered me. If anything, it could be to your advantage to know they are going to bump it preflop before looking at their cards. They are providing you with the same information as their bud at this point.

Now if they looked at their cards, then said it, that's a whole 'nother situation and they should be booted.

b

Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

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I am not sure how bad the Bump it up comment is. I have been at tables where people get crazy and just cap PF blind. Its not like there is an advantage there for them. The advantage in that scenario is actually yours, since you dont have any money in the pot yet, and can only enter is with premiums. The always raising people out, and then signal comments are collustion. But the blind raising is usually just for fun.

C-Dog

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Say nobody had heard their comment and also that the other players at the table were relatively weak. So, there's $7 in the pot pre-flop. UTG raises and his buddy re-raises. If nobody has a strong hand, they take the kill and both blinds w/o any problem. Then of course, if somebody does call, they're playing the hand 2 against 1. How is that not an advantage???

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You're combining two different things here. The key is that everyone can hear their plan and no one has any information on the cards yet. Once the cards are out and added info is known, THEN it's worth bitching about if they're still yapping.

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and also that the other players at the table were relatively weak

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Irrelevant.

Simply raising blind preflop isn't colluding.

You can't force someone to look at their hand before raising. Adjust accordingly.

Btw...Preflop capped straddles are great when you have a nice hand to come in with behind them.

b

Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

[ QUOTE ]
As far as the rules go, how is the "bump it up" comment before the cards were dealt any different than a group showing up at a table with the intention of magoo-ing it up and 5-betting everything in sight?


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It isn't. I remember a game with GoT, Dude and Slavic where Dude provoked GoT to straddle Dude's big blind. Then he got 3 bet, I think Dude capped blind. GoT had a real disheartened look on his face as he checked his cards when the action got back to him but called lest he would be deemed a pussy by Dude especially since Dude capped it blind(iirc). It was pretty funny.

b

Re: Potowatomi collusion
 

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I think this is kind of a general problem with Indian gaming casinos.

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I think you mean generally smaller casinos/cardrooms with about 4 tables max. Not just Indian Casinos.

b