Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

Sure it is an aquired skill. I worked my way up from 4.....Now I sometimes play 13 if I feel like it. Depends on my mood and wether I am having a winning session.

My monitor setup includes 2 Dell 24" widscreens and a laptop monitor. Nothing special, alot of screen real estate though. Minimal overlap but I do not mind.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
You are totally Phallusy.

[/ QUOTE ]

goood call....

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
Both of you guys and VanVeen cough up how you do this, especially the 13-tabler. How do you handle it when you have four simultaneous hands that require playing? How do you handle the repetitive motion trauma? I am really interested.

[/ QUOTE ]4 simultaneous? then I make quicker decisions! Repetitive motion trauma what? I only play for like 2-3 hour MAX sessions usually when I 8-9table.

[ QUOTE ]
Can you post your monitor setup? I have twin Samusung 213T's and lay four tables across the top with PokerOffice boxes underneath each. I take it you instead use a PT heads-up display? Or do you use four monitors? If you use four monitors, what type of rack do you use?


[/ QUOTE ]I have two monitors, but I don't even like putting 4 on each, I prefer just putting them all on one monitor with overlap and I don't user pokertracker really.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
You do it by unknownly playing basic and slowly all decisions merge to looking the same, fine details dissappear, constructive complete thoughts get replaced by 'i have trips i have to call'. Eventually your game becomes worse than it was 6 months ago but you also have the fun of looking forward to the time you get to tilt off stacks when you time out of you $1000 pot with top set.

[/ QUOTE ]


Every starts off well when super multi-tabling because it's fun and rewarding. Then it gets old and hard and then your play and results suffer.

My limit holdem game was traumatized by 10 tabling for a while.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

i once caught a fish thiiiiiiiiiis big...

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
You are totally Phallusy.
-James

[/ QUOTE ]

I like playing Phallusy.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

Matt,

4-table bigger games, lose the HUD. It's not worth the aggravation multi-tabling more than that. These kids are young, they are all about text messaging and video games and what not. We old folks should stick to 4.

I've 8-tabled before just to try it out and I didn't have much problem with it, I just found that it was hard to be really creative and the poker was much less fun.

The 10+ table stuff doesn't impress me. What does is Prahlad and GoG playing 3 or 4 50-100 HU tables, sometimes vs. different opponents. I've seen Pra playing even more than that, but 3 or 4 HU 50-100 is very standard for these guys. Sick.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You are totally Phallusy.
-James

[/ QUOTE ]

I like playing Phallusy.

[/ QUOTE ]

You people are so mean.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

Don't say this:

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe one day you too can play at all my tables. I just dont recommend it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Then pussy out like this:

[ QUOTE ]
No that is not my SN and I would prefer not to say what it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

I went through a stretch where I tried this, playing 10 or more tables and it was using 4 21 inch monitors running at 1600x1200 res, all side by side, using Pokerview for HUD the pt stats on the table itself. That took up 3 monitors, the fourth was usually 2+2, email, im, etc. Obviously I've been both multitable and using computers in this configuation for years. I already had this setup for working in my development environment. It's quite profitible but boring as all hell, grinding to the ultimate extreme. If you are playing very tight, you'd be surprised how seldom you wind up with decisions on more than 2 tables at the same time, it really doesn't happen that often and if like me some of your tables were Pokerstars, the extra time on those tables was usually sufficient.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

I have to second this, I haven't seen evidence anyone playing 10 tables for substantial periods lately. I haven't been playing 10/20 hardly at all the last few weeks but this sort of thing shows up in PT stats very, very quickly so I'm a little dubious of how many hours you are playing. That said, unlike most of the responses, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see you have success with this approach, Kristelita/Alikings dragged out a ton of money in the last 6 months using exactly this approach.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

I can see 8-tables wouldn't be nearly as enjoyable. Pretty much work, although fun work. At some price point it's worth it to me to do that for 5-6 hours/week as a second job. Plus I am getting into country music and have a lot of albums to listen to while playing.

Where are there good 6-max 10-20 games? 10-handed poker is mopeds and Gallo red. Sometimes you can find shorthanded games on longhanded tables, but they fill b/c the pots get big. Too much hassle to keep skipping around tables.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

Do you realize that playing more hands at a time increases variance?

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

prima; though it does seem to be a dying site.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
Do you realize that playing more hands at a time increases variance?

[/ QUOTE ]

(it doesn't increase variance)

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Do you realize that playing more hands at a time increases variance?

[/ QUOTE ]

(it doesn't increase variance)

[/ QUOTE ]
((it depends))
(((on how it affects your play)))
((((if at all))))

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Do you realize that playing more hands at a time increases variance?

[/ QUOTE ]

(it doesn't increase variance)

[/ QUOTE ]
((it depends))
(((on how it affects your play)))
((((if at all))))

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha, I guess if playing more hands makes you play in some style that increases your standard deviation then you could be right. You always hear about these guys who push more small edges and play looser when they multitable [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
-James

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

and some people become more prone to tilt when they play too many tables, etc. But, yes, if you play exactly the same then your StDev/hand stays the same no matter how many tables you play. Although, due to the large number of hands you are playing, the StDev/hr DOES decrease.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

I personally have no fun playing poker at all. I do not consider it fun, when I am playing I consider it work and because of this I dont mind it. Playing 10 tables is mentally exhausting. Most of the time I do not enjoy playing poker. I play because I love money.

For those of you with responses that are mocking the people in this thread who say they multitable 10 tables or more, I feel sorry for you. Your envy is transparent.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Do you realize that playing more hands at a time increases variance?

[/ QUOTE ]

(it doesn't increase variance)

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes it does. Think about it.

If you play 1 hand in one minute versus 100 hands in one minute, then at the end of one minute, in which case do you expect to experience higher variance?

Of course it's the 100 hands case.

I am not referring to variance per hand.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
Can you outline your monitor setup? Do you use 2 or 4? Box or line? Horizontal or vertical orientations? Thanks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Matt,

I use two computers and three monitors with 1600x1200 resolution. I like the two mouse set up. The most irritating thing for me is when the tables continue to pop up, making it difficult for me to type in a bet (or chat). Moving half the games to another computer helps with this annoyance.

I can put up to 8 full size tables on the dual monitor computer and three full size plus three UB in mini-view on the other. Usually I keep it to 11 games at peak times, and my table hour/hour average is about 8.5.

If you try this out for an extended period of time, I'd be really curious to get your opinion on how much big time multi tabling affects your big blinds/table hour. I am constantly torn between playing fewer games better and more games with a lower winrate. I figure even if my winrate is cut in half (per table hour), if I play twice as many games, I'll make more (based on rakeback and bonus). Overall, I would like to balance my play between making the most money and getting better at poker. I really feel like I've stagnated with regards to getting better over the last six or seven months. Of course the flip side of that is $$$$$.

Thanks

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

Wrong. Think about it.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
Wrong. Think about it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hope you still have time to edit your post.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

I probably do, but I don't think I'm going to check.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]

Yes it does. Think about it.

If you play 1 hand in one minute versus 100 hands in one minute, then at the end of one minute, in which case do you expect to experience higher variance?

Of course it's the 100 hands case.

I am not referring to variance per hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

what are you talking about?

you can easily make, say, +20 BBs in one hand. that gives you 20 BB/hand. however, if you play 100 hands, i dont think youre going to see 20 BB/hand.

that one hand can also easily be -100 BB, 0 BB, -1 BB, +7BB, etc.

larger sample size = less variance

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
If you play 1 hand in one minute versus 100 hands in one minute, then at the end of one minute, in which case do you expect to experience higher variance?


[/ QUOTE ]
What about variance if you play 1 M hands/minute? Think about it.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

what about if I play 15 tables and look at hot chicks on myspace? How does this affect my variance?

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

I did this for the better part of the year, extremely boring and extremely stressful. The biggest problem with this style of play is that it magnifies tilting to the extreme. If your game is off than its off on 10 tables instead of just four. RSI is also a big issue, I can't do it anymore because my wrists can't take it.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Wrong. Think about it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hope you still have time to edit your post.

[/ QUOTE ]

Heehee, this is excellent. Go Nasty, eff the haters.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I am not referring to variance per hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

what are you talking about?

you can easily make, say, +20 BBs in one hand. that gives you 20 BB/hand. however, if you play 100 hands, i dont think youre going to see 20 BB/hand.

that one hand can also easily be -100 BB, 0 BB, -1 BB, +7BB, etc.

larger sample size = less variance

[/ QUOTE ]

I think people are confusing the variance of their bankroll, and the variance per hand (i.e. BB/100). Of course if you're talking in terms of bankroll, the variance is going to increase as a function of how many hands you play. If you've only played 1 hand, you can't be down more than 12BB's, and can't be up more than 108BB's. After a million hands, your bankroll is going to be up (or down) a whole lot more than this range..

In terms of BB/100, it should work the other way. The variance of your BB/100 will go down as you play more hands. After 1 hand, your BB/100 could really be anything (from -12*100 to +108*100), but after 1mm hands, it's going to have a pretty narrow range. I really dont feel like crunching numbers, but I'm guessing it's going to be within a 1BB/100 spread.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
Of course if you're talking in terms of bankroll, the variance is going to increase as a function of how many hands you play.

[/ QUOTE ]

gold.

seriously, how is this still a conversation?

Barron

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Of course if you're talking in terms of bankroll, the variance is going to increase as a function of how many hands you play.

[/ QUOTE ]

gold.

seriously, how is this still a conversation?

Barron

[/ QUOTE ]

Because no one mentioned the central limit theorem yet? Haven't taken any stats in a while, but I'm pretty sure that provides the definitive answer.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Of course if you're talking in terms of bankroll, the variance is going to increase as a function of how many hands you play.

[/ QUOTE ]

gold.

seriously, how is this still a conversation?

Barron

[/ QUOTE ]

because nasty posted something that didnt make sense, unless he was talking about the variance of his bankroll? and because it seems to be a source of common confusion?

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

Somehow the dumbest thread in weeks got even dumber.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
Of course if you're talking in terms of bankroll, the variance is going to increase as a function of how many hands you play.

[/ QUOTE ]

you're an MITer, right?

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Of course if you're talking in terms of bankroll, the variance is going to increase as a function of how many hands you play.

[/ QUOTE ]

you're an MITer, right?

[/ QUOTE ]
You havent heard the "Variance is directionally proportional to number of hands played" law, derived by Phil Hellmuth.
If you play 1 hand, you can only get 2 outed once..if you play 10, u can get 2 outed 10 times.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Of course if you're talking in terms of bankroll, the variance is going to increase as a function of how many hands you play.

[/ QUOTE ]

you're an MITer, right?

[/ QUOTE ]
Just because you couldn't hack it, doesn't mean you have to be a hater.

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Of course if you're talking in terms of bankroll, the variance is going to increase as a function of how many hands you play.

[/ QUOTE ]

you're an MITer, right?

[/ QUOTE ]
You havent heard the "Variance is directionally proportional to number of hands played" law, derived by Phil Hellmuth.
If you play 1 hand, you can only get 2 outed once..if you play 10, u can get 2 outed 10 times.

[/ QUOTE ]

Question for you: if you add two independent normal distributions, what is the variance of the result?

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

[ QUOTE ]
Question for you: if you add two independent normal distributions, what is the variance of the result?

[/ QUOTE ]

There's nothing normal about these distributions. ;-)


(I threw in the ;-) so the literalists wouldn't have a hissy fit.)

Re: 10 Table NL 2000 on Party to reduce variance
 

how does 10 tabling reduce variance?