Re: World Cup Fever
 

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The US is highly unlikely to be seeded, whereas Mexico will probably get seeded due to their lofty FIFA ranking.



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Actually Mexico (7th) is ranked only one spot higher than USA (8th).
No bias here to you Yanks, but this is clearly a misnomer.

The seedings for the WC Final Groups was calculated on a far more complicated and elaborate system which took in account previous WC Final performances and Mexico edged out USA on the count that USA failed miserably in the 1998 WC.

Arena was just recently quoted as saying Australia & Trinidad & Tobago will be a laughing stock at this coming WC. He has a lot of balls saying this coz outside the US the Yanks are the laughing stock in this sport!

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How long will the poor 1998 showing be held against USA? That was eight years ago.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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How long will the poor 1998 showing be held against USA? That was eight years ago.

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The way FIFA has seeded the teams for the last 2 WC, if we were to use that formula then this is the last time.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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but its ridiculous to use that as any indicator of how good usa is now.

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exactly. I don't get why this is so hard for these guys to realize

Re: World Cup Fever
 

So when Friday is the draw? That ESPN article said it's 90 minutes long. My TV Guide says 2-3PM Central Friday. Is the draw only 1 hour?

Re: World Cup Fever
 

All I know is Spain shouldnt be in the top group and that Concacaf deserves one and only one seed( either Usa or Mexico, u can make a case for both of them).
Its funny how destiny works, I remember year 98 when Romania was chosen as a seed instead of England,England ended up in the same group as Romania and Romania went on to beat England 2-1.
Anyway lets play the easiest group possible and hardest group possible game, Ill do it by Usa point of view since I know most posters are americans.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

worst possible draw for USA:
Their own group:
Brazil
Ivory Coast( paraguay cant be chosen)
Holland.

The group they would face on round 2:
Argentina
Ghana
Czech.Rep
Serbia& Montenegro

best possible draw:
their group:
Mexico
Angola
Poland

the group they would face on round 2:
Spain
Togo
Switzerland
T&Tobago

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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worst possible draw for USA:
Their own group:
Brazil
Ivory Coast( paraguay cant be chosen)
Holland.

The group they would face on round 2:
Argentina
Ghana
Czech.Rep
Serbia& Montenegro

best possible draw:
their group:
Mexico
Angola
Poland

the group they would face on round 2:
Spain
Togo
Switzerland
T&Tobago

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I was under the impression that Mexico couldn't be in their group, so your best possible draw needs revision.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

RRRRICK,

You might be right. Ronaldihnio may have passed Henry as the best player in the world.

I had the pleasure of watching him live in Philadelphia right after he joined Barca. He is amazing.

-Fink

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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but its ridiculous to use that as any indicator of how good usa is now.

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exactly. I don't get why this is so hard for these guys to realize

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BIAS...

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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RRRRICK,

You might be right. Ronaldihnio may have passed Henry as the best player in the world.

I had the pleasure of watching him live in Philadelphia right after he joined Barca. He is amazing.

-Fink

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Its an absolute no brainer. He will win FIFA footballer of the year in a canter. I watched him totally bamboozle the star studed Real Madrid, even the Madrid fans applauded him.

He's a freak and could very well go to Germany and have a picnic

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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He's a freak and could very well go to Germany and have a picnic

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Could you imagine how many chicks this guy would pick up if only he had straight teeth...

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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He's a freak and could very well go to Germany and have a picnic

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Could you imagine how many chicks this guy would pick up if only he had straight teeth...

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I think what the point that you're missing is that myself and probably the other posters don't necessarily feel the US deserves a seed or the #8 rank, but that Mexico should not be over the US. This is what I have an issue with.

I think Holland should be seeded, but clearly their absence in '02 explains that.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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I think what the point that you're missing is that myself and probably the other posters don't necessarily feel the US deserves a seed or the #8 rank, but that Mexico should not be over the US. This is what I have an issue with.


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If the seedings were based just on FIFA rankings then there would be questions raised about how some of these teams got so high.

FIFA try and separate teams from same Confederations and will definitely no have teams who played against each other in the qualifying stage for the WC.

I don't know how you can complain about Mexico being seeded.
Although the USA won the Hexagonal qualifiers, USA was only on top by the lone goal that they scored in the Aztec Stadium when they lost 2-1 on March 27, 2005.

Winning the qualifying group is only one factor in the seeding process.

Lets see who USA draws and who Mexico draws as a seed.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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He's a freak and could very well go to Germany and have a picnic

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Could you imagine how many chicks this guy would pick up if only he had straight teeth...

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I think what the point that you're missing is that myself and probably the other posters don't necessarily feel the US deserves a seed or the #8 rank, but that Mexico should not be over the US. This is what I have an issue with.

I think Holland should be seeded, but clearly their absence in '02 explains that.

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Ok heres my 2 cents

I don't think the seeds represent the best 8 teams in the world at the moment. But then again who are the best 8 teams right now. Isn't this why we have the WC to determine the best teams in the World.

I don't envy FIFA's job at having to seed teams based on historical results as old as 98 and FIFA rankings which we all know are flawed. Overall once the groups are drawn there are usually fairly even strenghts between groups with a few exceptions. We usually see one group of death and one softish group.

Getting back to the seedings, Brazil aside it's difficult to say how good any of those teams really are at the minute.
The WC is the only time that we see teams from the differing regions playing against eachother in full battle(don't tell me friendlies, they don't count)

Traditionally S.America and Europe have been the heavyweights but we saw in the last WC that that gulf got a lot smaller and various Asian, African and Central American teams performed very well.

So I think the point I'm trying to make is that the seedings are not as important as they once were back when the big teams were lightyears ahead of the rest.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

i was disappointed to see that nigeria didnt qualify for this WC. the super eagles were a fun bunch to watch & root for in recent yrs (esp during the '96 summer games in atlanta)

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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I don't understand either of your points. I'm done with you.

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Of course you don't...

Here's an example why you guys are the laughing stock - Outside the USA!

From The Age - Melbourne

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We also suck at rugby. And cricket.

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We rock at economic domination though. Let them have their soccer.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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Getting back to the seedings, Brazil aside it's difficult to say how good any of those teams really are at the minute.
The WC is the only time that we see teams from the differing regions playing against eachother in full battle(don't tell me friendlies, they don't count)



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You've made some good points Brudder RRRRRICK...

Just one correction. There is anudder competition which teams from different Confederations play against each other.

Its not a big highlight but it is usually played 1 year before the WC as a prep or trial run. During our Northern summer this year the FIFA Confederarions Cup was played in Germany. In this competition each confederation champion is invited. Our OZ team was there and - Guess who represented CONCACAF.

It was Mexico!!!!

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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I don't understand either of your points. I'm done with you.

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Of course you don't...

Here's an example why you guys are the laughing stock - Outside the USA!

From The Age - Melbourne

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We also suck at rugby. And cricket.

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We rock at economic domination though. Let them have their soccer.

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Too bad that China doesn't have that in mind...

And their footy team is also improving.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

This whole "rankings" discussion is retarded. It's clear the US is one of the top 16 teams in the WC. It's also clear they would be an underdog against: Brazil, Argentina, England, Italy, Netherlands. Very likely underdogs against France, Spain, Portugal, Germany and Czech Republic. They're on par with Sweden and Mexico.

Also notice that if there is a "Group of Death", the US must be one of the teams in it (as there's pretty much no other team in either the US or Australia "pots" that is as good as the US, except maybe Japan)

The US desperately needs to avoid Netherlands, Czech Republic, and Portugal. They would be an underdog to make it out of the group stage. If they're in a group with Switzerland, Poland, Sweden, Croatia, or Ukraine, they have a good chance to advance to the second round.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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The US desperately needs to avoid Netherlands, Czech Republic, and Portugal. They would be an underdog to make it out of the group stage. If they're in a group with Switzerland, Poland, Sweden, Croatia, or Ukraine, they have a good chance to advance to the second round

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Nice post, pudley. My only disagreement is that as a U.S. fan, I don't want any part of Sweden, either.

-McGee

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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This whole "rankings" discussion is retarded. It's clear the US is one of the top 16 teams in the WC. It's also clear they would be an underdog against: Brazil, Argentina, England, Italy, Netherlands. Very likely underdogs against France, Spain, Portugal, Germany and Czech Republic. They're on par with Sweden and Mexico.

Also notice that if there is a "Group of Death", the US must be one of the teams in it (as there's pretty much no other team in either the US or Australia "pots" that is as good as the US, except maybe Japan)

The US desperately needs to avoid Netherlands, Czech Republic, and Portugal. They would be an underdog to make it out of the group stage. If they're in a group with Switzerland, Poland, Sweden, Croatia, or Ukraine, they have a good chance to advance to the second round.

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Well if Croatia, 3rd in WC1998 who defeated Holland 2-1 is a minnow then good luck.

However, I would prefer my genetic homeland YKPAIHA to be drawn against Yankeeland. That would be an enjoyable game to be at in Germany!

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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Well if Croatia, 3rd in WC1998 who defeated Holland 2-1 is a minnow then good luck.


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Again, you're focused on 1998. You do realize that another World Cup happened between then and now, right? I know it was on TV at odd hours, but trust me, it happened. And in it, Croatia - despite a victory over Italy -- didn't make it to the second stage, losing to Mexico and Ecuador in group play. They also didn't advance past the Group Stage in Euro 2004.

They had an excellent qualifying run, finishing atop UEFA Group 8 by going unbeaten, with wins over Sweden home and away, but it's just silly to keep judging teams, as you've been doing, by their performance in 1998. This is a far different side than the one that Suker and Prosinecki led to the semi-finals in France.

-McGee

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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This whole "rankings" discussion is retarded. It's clear the US is one of the top 16 teams in the WC. It's also clear they would be an underdog against: Brazil, Argentina, England, Italy, Netherlands. Very likely underdogs against France, Spain, Portugal, Germany and Czech Republic. They're on par with Sweden and Mexico.

Also notice that if there is a "Group of Death", the US must be one of the teams in it (as there's pretty much no other team in either the US or Australia "pots" that is as good as the US, except maybe Japan)

The US desperately needs to avoid Netherlands, Czech Republic, and Portugal. They would be an underdog to make it out of the group stage. If they're in a group with Switzerland, Poland, Sweden, Croatia, or Ukraine, they have a good chance to advance to the second round.

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Well if Croatia, 3rd in WC1998 who defeated Holland 2-1 is a minnow then good luck.

However, I would prefer my genetic homeland YKPAIHA to be drawn against Yankeeland. That would be an enjoyable game to be at in Germany!

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I just hope we can avoid Denmark (QF lost 3-2 to Brazil @ 1998 WC), Norway (2nd round lost 1-0 to Italy), and Chile (2nd round lost to Brazil).

I really hope we avoid 2002 Semifinalist Turkey, and 2002 QF Senegal.

Oh wait, none of those teams qualified...

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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Well if Croatia, 3rd in WC1998 who defeated Holland 2-1 is a minnow then good luck.


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Again, you're focused on 1998. You do realize that another World Cup happened between then and now, right? I know it was on TV at odd hours, but trust me, it happened. And in it, Croatia - despite a victory over Italy -- didn't make it to the second stage, losing to Mexico and Ecuador in group play. They also didn't advance past the Group Stage in Euro 2004.

They had an excellent qualifying run, finishing atop UEFA Group 8 by going unbeaten, with wins over Sweden home and away, but it's just silly to keep judging teams, as you've been doing, by their performance in 1998. This is a far different side than the one that Suker and Prosinecki led to the semi-finals in France.

-McGee

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I'm focused on 1998 because that WC was held in Europe...
Next year's World Cup is going to be held not far from where that oneas held.
The geographic location is going to help all European Teams - especially teams like Croatia, Serbia&M, Ukraine and maybe even Switzerland.

I mean they did take out Turkey on aggregrate in a playoff to qualify, a team which was 3rd in WC2002.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

Then why not look at the 1974 World Cup? It's got just as much relevance.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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Then why not look at the 1974 World Cup? It's got just as much relevance.

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Actually its worth looking at all WCs...

In fact in 1974 Australia was there...

Sorry, no USA.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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Its not a big highlight but it is usually played 1 year before the WC as a prep or trial run. During our Northern summer this year the FIFA Confederarions Cup was played in Germany. In this competition each confederation champion is invited. Our OZ team was there and - Guess who represented CONCACAF.

It was Mexico!!!!


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any why- because they won the concacaf gold cup in 2003. Hmmm, I wonder why you're focusing on the past? who could have won the concacaf gold cup in 2005?

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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Its not a big highlight but it is usually played 1 year before the WC as a prep or trial run. During our Northern summer this year the FIFA Confederarions Cup was played in Germany. In this competition each confederation champion is invited. Our OZ team was there and - Guess who represented CONCACAF.

It was Mexico!!!!


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any why- because they won the concacaf gold cup in 2003. Hmmm, I wonder why you're focusing on the past? who could have won the concacaf gold cup in 2005?

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Well it was too bad that the 2005 CONCACAF Gold Cup was held after the FIFA Confederation Cup. Otherwise you guys could claim that Panama was a really a top class team!

Bwahahahaha

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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I mean they did take out Turkey on aggregrate in a playoff to qualify, a team which was 3rd in WC2002.

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This discussion would be far more interesting and productive if you'd focus your arguments on things like this.

-McGee

Re: World Cup Fever
 

Brudder,

For someone who seems to know something about soccer, you aren't saying anything intelligent.

It is not 1998 anymore. Just because 98 was in France and 02 was in Asia, 98 is NOT more relevant that 02. The US roster, in fact all rosters, are going to be (nearly) completely different than they were in 1998.

1998 is pratically irrelevant, almost as irrelevant as 1974. FIFA uses previous World Cups as measures to seed teams, but that does NOT mean that previous WC's are a predictor of what will happen in this year's WC.

It's like saying Brazil will win the 06 WC because they have won it more times than anyone. No, Brazil will (probably) win it because they are the best team NOW. Pele has zero effect on the 2006 Brazil WC team.

What happened in the past with different players does not effect what will happen in the future with current players.

-Fink

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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Brudder,

For someone who seems to know something about soccer, you aren't saying anything intelligent.

It is not 1998 anymore. Just because 98 was in France and 02 was in Asia, 98 is NOT more relevant that 02.

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That is your opinion...

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The US roster, in fact all rosters, are going to be (nearly) completely different than they were in 1998.

1998 is pratically irrelevant, almost as irrelevant as 1974. FIFA uses previous World Cups as measures to seed teams, but that does NOT mean that previous WC's are a predictor of what will happen in this year's WC.



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No kidding...

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It's like saying Brazil will win the 06 WC because they have won it more times than anyone. No, Brazil will (probably) win it because they are the best team NOW. Pele has zero effect on the 2006 Brazil WC team.



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Brazil is the only nonEuropean team to win a WC staged in Europe. (Stated before in 1958 Sweden).




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What happened in the past with different players does not effect what will happen in the future with current players.

-Fink

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Good luck...

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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I mean they did take out Turkey on aggregrate in a playoff to qualify, a team which was 3rd in WC2002.

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This discussion would be far more interesting and productive if you'd focus your arguments on things like this.

-McGee

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I think there is a lot of good in this discussion...

Of course I expect stubborn opposition to a smart arsed foreigner - who resides in the US but doesn't fully support them like the majority of posters on this site.

No problems. I'm glad the US is performing better and that raises the prospects for better coverage here in the US next year.

I will be in Germany and Ukraine during the WCFinals - So I will be also interested in the US and how my birth country Australia performs. A wide range of choices makes for enjoyment in watching the spectacle.

Re: World Cup Fever
 

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Getting back to the seedings, Brazil aside it's difficult to say how good any of those teams really are at the minute.
The WC is the only time that we see teams from the differing regions playing against eachother in full battle(don't tell me friendlies, they don't count)



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You've made some good points Brudder RRRRRICK...

Just one correction. There is anudder competition which teams from different Confederations play against each other.

Its not a big highlight but it is usually played 1 year before the WC as a prep or trial run. During our Northern summer this year the FIFA Confederarions Cup was played in Germany. In this competition each confederation champion is invited. Our OZ team was there and - Guess who represented CONCACAF.

It was Mexico!!!!

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True

But again not a great deal can be taken from it.

Nations competing in the Confeds Cup don't take in that seriously.