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-   -   How many ways did I stuff this up??? (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=365028)

WalkAmongUs 10-25-2005 10:16 AM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
[ QUOTE ]
There's only 1 other preflop raiser. UTG raise-folded preflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Figured I missed something. In that case I might give your overs something like 4-4.5 outs.

ArturiusX 10-25-2005 10:19 AM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
The problem with calling the flop is we still have someone left to act behind us. Plus our outs are a bit tainted possibly.

bozlax 10-25-2005 10:22 AM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
You run into more trouble, tho, if it's 3-bet and capped after you call. Then you're getting 28:4...I'll let you finish that off. And, you're assuming that you're not drawing dead to a set.

@bsolute_luck 10-25-2005 10:26 AM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
[ QUOTE ]
The problem with calling the flop is we still have someone left to act behind us. Plus our outs are a bit tainted possibly.

[/ QUOTE ]

i took this into consideration with the outs (at least i thought i did with 3 outs to OCs which i gave figuring we're not up against a flush draw right here) plus MP's aggression is nothing, so i really doubt he's 3-betting us here.

10-25-2005 10:33 AM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
[ QUOTE ]
Preflop: no worries. (I love UTG's preflop line, btw. Give him a biiiiig note, "Might bluff-raise pf utg.")

Flop: Uh, I don't think you can check this after capping, preflop, or, if you do it's with the intention of check-folding, not check-calling-two-cold-not-closing-the-action. I actually prefer check-folding this flop, I think...you've got 2 opps with hands they liked enough to survive a preflop cap betting and raising into you, and you have no way of knowing it won't be 3-bet and capped after you call. You missed. MP2 and Button don't think they did. Let it go.

[/ QUOTE ]

I had actually planned to check/raise the button <font color="blue"> (Is this bad?), </font> I was still confident against his 3 bet range, and I thought there was a good chance MP2 would fold without close to the nuts. I was 95% button would bet when checked to. When MP2 bet out, and then button raised (of course) I was stuck in the head lights. I figured I had the odds to peel but was definitely folding the turn UI, regardless of who bet.

davelin 10-25-2005 11:40 AM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
Maybe I'm rusty but I'd consider folding the flop facing 2 (and possibly more).

bozlax 10-25-2005 12:00 PM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
[ QUOTE ]
I had actually planned to check/raise the button...I was 95% button would bet when checked to.

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh, from his stats, Button looks to be a pretty good TAG. You capped him preflop. What's he going to bet into you that you're ahead of or even have a decent draw against?

[ QUOTE ]
I figured I had the odds to peel but was definitely folding the turn UI, regardless of who bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

You were ok peeling, but IMO it's on the bubble. The problem is, after the flop action you have no way of putting either of your opponents on hands that you're going to beat even if you do hit one of your top pair outs, and your flush and straight outs are longshots that make your TP outs better, but still aren't very good. And, given that MP2 liked his hand enough to bet into two preflop raisers (after you check), you have no guarantee that you're going to get to the turn for just 2 bets.

bozlax 10-25-2005 12:02 PM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
[ QUOTE ]
...plus MP's aggression is nothing, so i really doubt he's 3-betting us here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd have doubted that he'd bet into 2 preflop raisers having shown no previous aggression in the hand...so, I guess maybe he's happy with his hand?

milesdyson 10-25-2005 12:18 PM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
in my experience, there are 3 different places to stuff "it" up. they are all warm, and one is particularly elusive.

TomBrooks 10-25-2005 02:20 PM

Re: How many ways did I stuff this up???
 
I'd peel getting 13:1.


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