Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

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This is why you need to bet the turn more. He should c/r this turn all-in, by the way, and you should fold. And your check behind is good. I don't see what value you think you have in betting the river. Even with top pair here, he's not going to pay you off most likely. What are you betting with on all three streets?

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I disagree with you here. He could easily talk himself into calling here by thinking "hmmm maybe he has 10 10 or 99, i'll call." Also, we don't know that he's on a flush draw, so he could have a pocket pair higher than the flop and just be a jackass calling station. I'll ask you a question, what hands that beat hero could you see villian checking three times?

Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

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This is why you need to bet the turn more. He should c/r this turn all-in, by the way, and you should fold. And your check behind is good. I don't see what value you think you have in betting the river. Even with top pair here, he's not going to pay you off most likely. What are you betting with on all three streets?

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You could be right that he wouldnt pay me off, but he does have TP and alot of people pay off with that all the time in my games. A good player wont do it, but is a good player calling $12 preflop with JTs out of position? I know, Im not.

Either way, my river play needs work in general. And youre right, if he check raises the turn all in, Im folding.

Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

check/raising the turn here would be great in my opinion because he might have the best hand, you might fold a better hand, and even if you call he has tons of outs. i know you know that, but just thought I'd mention in any case. It also makes him harder to play against in the future. And on the other point, I could see him checking a set three times (I have even seen it at NL100).

Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

I dont mind the second check behind as much as the first. With AA there i would bet the river one last time. ALthough he was prob on aflush draw and missed. Very few players there at 1-2 are patient enought to slow play a set or two pair. A check isnt horrible though as he prob wouldnt call with a busted flush. Still i think you should value bet the river. On the second hand there is way two much out there interms of possible straight or two pair to bet i like the check. One more note. On the AA hand you need to bet more than what you were bettign. You were giving him great odds to draw to the flush as you were betting approx half the pot. YOu should at least be 70% on the pot IE bet on the tunr you should have at least be 60 not 45. That wasnt enough IMO also people tend to pay even money on draws which is a mistake on their part. Make them pay for drawing again i think 60-70 was a better bet than 45 at lest 55 and up.

Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

Declining to take free showdowns with one pair makes it extremely easy for even the dumbest of players to trap you. I love those people that think they are so cute by always "value betting" their pair for 1/3 pot on the river. Their hand is completely transparent and I'll just keep checking my hands to them all night long. How sweet is it to get a guy to bet your hand for you THREE times? There's no way for them to salvage the situation at the end because I know their hand and they don't know mine.

Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

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Declining to take free showdowns with one pair makes it extremely easy for even the dumbest of players to trap you. I love those people that think they are so cute by always "value betting" their pair for 1/3 pot on the river. Their hand is completely transparent and I'll just keep checking my hands to them all night long. How sweet is it to get a guy to bet your hand for you THREE times? There's no way for them to salvage the situation at the end because I know their hand and they don't know mine.

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Hmmm..maybe my river play isnt as bad as I was thinking then, because I check behind alot in hands like this.

Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

First hand :

I would bet the river, value bets are major source of income at 200NL. I would fold to any checkraise against an unknown here.

Second hand:

I would definitely value bet here, I dont believe that Villain wouldnt bet 2pairs on this river, check with 2pair+ is very strange here.

Best wishes

Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

[ QUOTE ]
Declining to take free showdowns with one pair makes it extremely easy for even the dumbest of players to trap you. I love those people that think they are so cute by always "value betting" their pair for 1/3 pot on the river. Their hand is completely transparent and I'll just keep checking my hands to them all night long. How sweet is it to get a guy to bet your hand for you THREE times? There's no way for them to salvage the situation at the end because I know their hand and they don't know mine.

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It's not like he's going to be making this play every time; he's not going to play that predictably. In this situation, i think that it's clear that hero is ahead, and if he's ahead, he should value bet. There's so many calling stations at this level that he can't afford to lose these extra bets. Sure, occasionally he's going to get slow played to the extreme, but the majority of the time in these situations, and specifically this situation, he's going to be ahead.

Re: 2 hands with river questions
 

in hand 1 i think if i was to value bet i'd push