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-   -   Bad Turn.... (http://archives2.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=254972)

ggbman 05-19-2005 08:03 AM

Re: Bad Turn....
 
I don't see why we would continue with this hand without a stellar read on the button.

Yeti 05-19-2005 08:16 AM

Re: Bad Turn....
 
Lead a bit more on the flop.

I wouldn't say there's any guarantee you're behind, but if Villain is good its gonna cost you two streets to find out.

ML4L 05-19-2005 10:00 AM

re: Flop Play
 
Hey KKF,

Contrary to what most other posters have said, I think that your flop play is actually very good. It's something that probably wouldn't have occurred to me in the heat of battle, but your thought process makes perfect sense.

Just to explain a little about why it's so good:

1) It lets you protect your hand from something like 66. As KKF pointed out, if you have a strong hand, this is even more important than normal.

2) It is a bet that will cause your opponents to make mistakes. It looks like a weak ace making a feeler bet or a draw looking for a cheap card (this is the absolute key to the bet; if OTHER people didn't play hands in this manner, KKF wouldn't be able to make this play). Thus, a strong ace will certainly call and maybe raise. Hell, you may induce a bluff from KQ thinking that he can take the pot off of you since you are clearly weak. Check-raising or leading out big minimizes the number of mistakes the opponents can make.

3) It exercises pot control to an extent. With a counterfeitable (that's definitely not a word?) hand out of position on a draw-laden board, I'm not necessarily looking to build a pot.

Yeah, a spade draw isn't making a real mistake by calling this bet, but I think that the benefits far outweigh this detail.

As to the turn play, not much for posters to say. Without a read, I think that it's close between calling and folding. But, I don't play Party 6-max, so I might be misestimating the times that he's making a move here.

In any event, I like the flop play and the resourcefulness that it shows. Hope the turn worked out.

ML4L

savman 05-19-2005 06:38 PM

Re: Bad Turn....
 
I agree with ML4L, you are not necessarily behind here. If CO had Ace *paint* then he would likely raise your weak bet on the flop. Therefore, CO could be on a draw here.....you check like the 9 was a bad card for you and he bets ~half pot. I might make this play with spades looking to take it down, and CO doesnt seem to be terribly strong here.

Why not check raise? If he has a bigger ace it will be a hard call for him here, aces you chop with are almost always folding, and if he is on a flush draw then you werent getting any more money from him unless he improved anyway. If he calls you have a decision. I push any non spade river assuming he has enough stack to give some fold equity.

barongreenback 05-20-2005 04:33 AM

Re: Bad Turn....
 
What other hands do you bet this amount on the flop with? Is it a regular play for you?


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