Re: Frustration with 3-6-12 - Move Up? - ?s about Clark\'s Thread
 

Read 1st 2/3rd of your post. Moving up because you cannot beat terrible-loose 3/6 players would be a disaster. If you cannot beat these players, you will not be able to beat the 10/20 players who have a real good idea what YOU have.

You are probably not playing enough suited cards in these loose-passive games, and are probably throwing away too many vulnerable pairs after the flop. You can certainly play 76s abnd A2s from any position. Since the pot is routinely large, you need to usually get to the river when you flop a pair (so long as there isn't any raising). You are also probably not betting/raising nearly enough with your draws on the flop.

There are not enough good hands to go around. With 7 players routinely seeing the flop, there may be only one "good hand" out there. Since there then 6 bad hands, the bad hands collectively are the favorite. I'd estimate that a "bad" hand is going to show-down win about 75% of the time. However, in this case the good hand is getting 6:1 for his money and is only a 75%:25% or 3:1 underdog.

That's a lot of money for the good hand to be making.

I think overall what you need to to get over this idea that the good hand is supposed to win.

- Louie

Re: Frustration with 3-6-12 - Move Up? - ?s about Clark\'s Thread
 

This is about how tight you should play in a normal structure. In this structure with the big bet on the river, you can be a lot looser than this from LP.

Re: Frustration with 3-6-12 - Move Up? - ?s about Clark\'s Thread
 

you mentioned Lousisiana? i live in Baton Rouge and am looking for some games. do you know of any around my area outside the casinos? you can email me if you do mtymouse911@hotmail.com

Re: Frustration with 3-6-12 - Move Up? - ?s about Clark\'s Thread
 

I can relate. I used to go out there and play too. I've come to hate the 3-6-12 type strucutre. I think the $12 big bet on the end encourages chasing (probably justified) and a lot of sandbagging (probably also justified) as people will chase and/or sandbag all the way to the river so they can pop you for $12. A lot of adjustments are needed for this type of game. Play a lot more hands and maybe be a little more passive.

For me, I quit playing in that game. I went to Vegas and played in some of the games there and the players are much better than those at Kinder. I now save the money up for Vegas trips.

It is hard to beat a game with $4 max rate plus a jackpot anyway, and that suckout enticing $12 bet on the river doesn't help anything. People love to just stay in all the way to the river so they can pop that $12 off if they hit their longshot. With 7 or 8 players in for most hands in those games the odds of somebody hitting their longshot is improved.

Plus, a lot of those players in Kinder are not very serious players to begin with. Most are there to have fun. Have you watched the 10-20-40 game there? It is usually being played by some tough players, but you can't change the fact that the 40 on the river will encourage players to chase more frequently than average since they can get paid off big if they do hit.

Re: Frustration with 3-6-12 - Move Up? - ?s about Clark\'s Thread
 

techsan, it's encouraging to hear from someone like you who has the same frustrations with the idiotic 3-6-12 structure. You are certainly correct in that most of the players are there to just have fun, and I am there to have fun as well. But, I also would like to learn how to play the game better, and build a bankroll to move up. I just need to make the necessary adjustments of loosening up and chasing more.

As far as watching the 10-20-40 game, I never have. Also, I'll never play it either because it would seem to be just a higher-risk version of 3-6-12. Once in a while they'll spread 6-12, which is a game I really want to play, but it is rare. I played 6-12 at the Mirage and had a blast without even though I ended up losing $24 in a 5 hour session. I am definitely looking forward to my next Vegas trip just because I had so much fun at the poker tables.

Re: Frustration with 3-6-12 - Move Up? - ?s about Clark\'s Thread
 

one thing you must be careful about in the spread games is chasing without the odds.you normally cannot play small suiteds unless you have four or more involved in the hand.be very wary of calling any draws on the flop.and were speaking here about a moderately aggressive spread game.if the game is as aggressive as you indicate,come in only with big cards and big suited.and do not defend your blinds!!this is a huge mistake to make in spread games.let your opponents defend their blinds.now these games also can become very passive for no particular reason.when passive,come in from any position with your small suited connector.now,remember that in these games ,any raise destroys your odds so,when raised unexpectantly,let go of your hand!phooey!but if you can tippy toe to the flop unmust by raisers,your small suiteds can bring down a huge pot of gold in these games.that is where the money is.wait until the game gets passive and sneak in there,always letting go if raised.of course ,play your big cards strongly.