Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

No, that's not the problem. You either use the textualist interpretation or the public policy interpretation. It's not the place of the floor to predict what BB would have done, basing the ruling on that prediction.

[Sorry, I'm a law student - this is how we think :P ]

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

Damn. I wrote up a very nice response to this and computer froze. Here's the frustrated version with poor attempts at copying lost wording:

It sucks, but the SB's hand is dead because this can be used as collusion.

To clarify, imagine that the tournament is on the bubble and SB shows a hand that let's BB know that the odds he's getting are slightly low. If BB folds here, it's usually a +EV play for both SB and BB, which means that the rest of the players in the tournament lose equity because SB showed his cards.

Since the floor can't distinguish between the example I just gave and this situation, the floor has to deal with them in similar ways--by killing the hand.

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

Haven't read any responses. IMO, this is a technicality, but the SB's hand is dead because he exposed his hand before declaring anything - "lets do it" is vague and his chips were moving in after exposing the hand.

Technically SB's hand is dead, IMO.

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

[ QUOTE ]
Haven't read any responses. IMO, this is a technicality, but the SB's hand is dead because he exposed his hand before declaring anything - "lets do it" is vague and his chips were moving in after exposing the hand.

Technically its a fold, IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

It has nothing to do with the fact that he hadn't declared his action yet, but the fact that another player still had to make a decision.

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

I agree-beat up BB in the parking lot

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

[ QUOTE ]
It makes a huge difference. If you are to say that exposure results in a dead hand, then the pot is won by BB at the point when the cards are exposed. In the OP, SB put chips in after exposing his hand. Verbal actions are binding. "let's do it" is not an action. "let's do it - I'm all-in" IS an action.

[/ QUOTE ]

i stand corrected. good point.

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

I would think his hand is dead after exposing his cards.
"let's do it" does not clearly imply all-in.
The subsequent action of grabbing all his chips is after his hand is dead.

On a sidenote: "poker players are scum"

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

OK, so almost everyone seems to agree that the hand was dead. What was the actual ruling?

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

I thought exposing your hand while still in and then not folding that hand was a 10 minute penalty, not that the hand is dead. That came up a few times down at Indiana WSOP and that is how the rule played out there. The player who exposed his hand when it was his turn to act was given an option of playing the rest of the hand and be given a 10 minute penalty or folding and no penalty.

Re: Tournament Ruling: You make the call
 

I think "let's do it" is irrelevant. It's whether or not exposing his cards while there is still action left should kill his hand. I think not. Exposing his cards does not benefit him at all as giving more information to the BB can only help, not hurt him.

I think there are a couple of options here. The standard ruling would be that the BB can decide whether or not to make the call pre-flop knowing what the SB has. A slightly more creative ruling could be to treat the SB's action as a call, and thus give the BB the chance to see the flop before deciding if he'll put in the few extra chips. A more aggressive version of that would be to require the SB to put all of his chips in the pot (force him to bet the remaining chips on the flop) but allow the BB to make his decision after the flop.