View Full Version : Ethical dilemna choosing button. Is it cheating?

04-28-2002, 05:04 PM
A strange thing happened yesterday afternoon when a new 15-30 game was being started at the Bellagio.

When starting a new Hold'em game, the Bellagio will scramble all the cards in the deck. Then, all the players will select a card. Whoever picks the highest card gets the button at the start of the game.

During the scramble, The Ac and 9h were accidentally flipped up by the dealer. He then turned them face down and did a half-ass scramble. However, it was painfully obvious where the Ac was.

Do I choose the card which I'm 99% sure is the Ac?

Or do I pick another card at random?

Or do I tell the dealer to do his job right?

Results: I picked the Ac. However, somebody else snagged the Ad and made it all irrelevent.

By the way, Pokerbabe and Hosh were at this table. Niether one of them seemed aware that this had happened.

04-28-2002, 06:01 PM
Not to change the subject, but at the Taj, when a new games starts, seat 10 is the button. seats one and two are the blinds. This doesn;t seem to be fair if you don't know this rule or are not the first one at the table. I;ve never been at a new game at the Trop so I don't know if this is an AC rule or just the Taj.

04-28-2002, 11:53 PM
This is not cheating. I would have done the same thing- wether it's ethical or not is subject to debate, but I don't feel that it is. This reminds me of the essay Mason wrote on front loading, in one of his Poker Essays books (vol.1 I think).


04-29-2002, 01:13 AM
"Do I choose the card which I'm 99% sure is the Ac? Or do I pick another card at random? Or do I tell the dealer to do his job right?"

I'd definitely never do that last thing. I think it's really bad for business, and vibes.

As to the draw, I'd probably pick a card at random and draw the ace of spades.


04-29-2002, 05:59 PM
If you are going to play more than a round what does it matter which card you draw? It is no worse than calling your hand Kings and Sixes.


05-01-2002, 01:21 AM
cheating? absolutely not...everyone had an opportunity for the same information. they should be paying attention.

ethical? since its a minor ethic violation if that, i wouldnt worry about it...after 10 hands whos gonna care anyways.

tell the dealer? no...they hear enough crap from players as it is...this is kinda petty, and you could be in a hand by the time she redoes it...

id pick the card too...


05-01-2002, 02:13 PM
if youve thought all of this before picking then the thing to do is stick your paw in there, do a self scramble, and then pick one.

if you just think, lucky me, i see the Ace, then grab it.

Not so precisely do we take it,

In a thousand steps may woman make it;

Yet though she hastes as ever she can,

In a single leap it's done by man.