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dantheman_05
01-12-2005, 03:54 AM
Being new to craps, I am looking for the best strategy. Are the odds always against me? Which bets give me the best "odds"?

gaming_mouse
01-12-2005, 07:00 AM
[ QUOTE ]
Being new to craps, I am looking for the best strategy. Are the odds always against me? Which bets give me the best "odds"?

[/ QUOTE ]

Betting "behind the line" on your points is the best bet in craps, as the casino will pay you the true odds on those bets.

You will always have to have one bet, though -- your original point -- which is not being paid the true odds, and this is where the casino's edge comes from.

So when you see casino's offering things like "30x odds" it means that for every \$1 you are wagering at reduced odds (ie, odds that give the casino a small advantage), you can wager up to \$30 at the true odds. If you do this, you will something very close to a fair game.

HTH,
gm

dantheman_05
01-12-2005, 08:21 AM
so i have to bet teh pass line first right? then i est a point. i can bet on that point in multipoles of \$6 and the casino will lay me the "correct" odds. for ex. the point is 10. so i have 3:36 odds in hitting a ten, but 1:6 to hit a 7. so if i amke another "behind the line" bet on 10 the casino will lay me what odds?-

MickeyHoldem
01-12-2005, 08:57 AM
Bets behind the line pay the following:

point 4,10...... 2 to 1
point 5,9....... 3 to 2
point 6,8....... 6 to 5

gaming_mouse
01-12-2005, 08:58 AM
[ QUOTE ]
so i have to bet teh pass line first right? then i est a point. i can bet on that point in multipoles of \$6 and the casino will lay me the "correct" odds. for ex. the point is 10. so i have 3:36 odds in hitting a ten, but 1:6 to hit a 7. so if i amke another "behind the line" bet on 10 the casino will lay me what odds?-

[/ QUOTE ]

A behind the line bet will pay the true odds, which, as you say, are 3:36. For ever 3 bet, you win 36.

You point bet, however, will be getting slightly less than that. I don't remember offhand what it is, but it will be something like 3:35 or 3:33.

dantheman_05
01-12-2005, 09:32 AM
i may be misunderstanding this concept. i fthe point is 10 iam a 12:1 dog to hit my point, buti am only getting 2:1 odds??how is thi s agood bet?

Precision1C
01-12-2005, 10:57 AM
When you make a point bet, say on a ten, you lose on a 7 and win on a ten all the other rolls are meaningless for this bet. So you compare the odds of getting a 7, 6/36, versus getting a 10, 3/36, so the odds of getting a 10 verus a 7 is 2:1.

tylerdurden
01-12-2005, 02:11 PM
One other thing... if you play the come line in addition to the pass line, make sure you tell the dealer you want your odds to work on the comeout. At most places odds are off on the comeout by default, though the original come bet is always working.

K C
01-12-2005, 02:22 PM
Frankly, the odds are the craps /images/graemlins/smile.gif

You might get lucky on a short run, but over time, the house must win. They have the laws of mathematics on their side. And they ensure that every line they offer has this built in.

People still play though, but ultimately, it's entertainment, like the lottery and other casino games.

KC
http://kingcobrapoker.com

dantheman_05
01-12-2005, 06:05 PM
okay, what about betting teh don't pass? i would be getting 2:1 odds on teh come out roll. there are 8 ways to hit 7 or 11 and only 6 ways to hit 2,3,12. so its a 8:6 underdog to win the dont pass bet on come out roll. but if a point is est. i am favorite to win right?? maybe this is the bet way to reduce the house advantage? (instead of playing teh pass line) i am also assuming all teh other bets are not worthy of taking. im not looking to play craps for a living, just want to have some fun /images/graemlins/smile.gif

gaming_mouse
01-12-2005, 06:26 PM
[ QUOTE ]
A behind the line bet will pay the true odds, which, as you say, are 3:36. For ever 3 bet, you win 36.

You point bet, however, will be getting slightly less than that. I don't remember offhand what it is, but it will be something like 3:35 or 3:33.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wooops. These numbers are off -- sorry if I confused you. The concept is correct though.

The reason the numbers are off is that the bet is not hitting your point on a single roll, but hitting your point before a 7.

gm

DrPublo
01-12-2005, 08:31 PM
This is a common fallacy. People think that if betting with the shooter is -EV, then betting with the house must be +EV. The problem is that the house takes away 12 from you on the dont pass, so they both wind up being -EV. Although I think the don't pass is slightly better for you.

The reason most people don't play the don't pass is because instead of taking odds, you have to lay odds. Example, you bet \$10 on the don't pass. The shooter makes a 10. Now you have to bet \$20 to win \$10, instead of the other way around (as it would be on the pass line). This is an unattractive option to most players even though its still a true odds bet.

Also some players get annoyed at the one guy who's betting against the shooter, while the whole table is betting with the shooter. Karma or something. While this is mathematically meaningless, if you're looking to have a good time you might not want to be the singled out guy on the table.

The Doc

01-14-2005, 02:08 PM
Playing "wrong" as its known (nothing wrong with it, it is just nomenclature for playing against the shooter) with max odds on your don't pass and don't come bets will give you a tiny advantage over doing the pass and come, but it is miniscule and it is a bummer being on a hot table watching everyone win while you lose. If the don't is hot, the table usually is somber or breaks up as everyone else is losing. Also, because you are laying odds you put more money out there on the table and if you run into a hot shooter you can get wiped out unless your bankroll is huge (i.e. high risk of ruin).

Ritter
01-14-2005, 04:39 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Being new to craps, I am looking for the best strategy. Are the odds always against me? Which bets give me the best "odds"?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, whether you bet the pass or don't pass ("right" or "wrong") the odds will always be against you and the house will always win in the long run. That said, if you play a good strategy, craps offers one of the lowest house edges available in the casino and can be a lot of fun to play in the right crowd. Just don't delude yourself into thinking you can beat the game in the long term - you can't.

As for the best strategy, it's pretty simple.

Make a pass line bet.

Once a point is established, take either the maximum odds the house will allow, or the highest odds your bankroll will permit (this is the bet placed behind the pass line bet, which the house pays "true" odds on).

Simultaneously with placing your odds bet behind the pass line bet, make a come bet equal to your pass line bet.

Take max odds on your come bet once another number hits.

Make another come bet with max odds so that you have three numbers working with max odds and stop betting until something hits.

When you hit one of your numbers, replace the bet with another come bet or pass line bet as appropriate.

Playing this way will reduce the house edge to somewhere between 1 or 2% depending on how much odds you're placing (greater the odds bet in relation to the line bet, less of a house edge).

If you can afford to play 100x odds, I think this reduces the house edge to less than 1%, but it's still enough to break you if you play long enough.

You can play in a similar fashion on the don't pass with a similar edge, but as previously mentioned, it's not as fun and people will hate you.

All other bets on the table suck - don't make them unless you just want to "gamboooool" and have fun.

Go for a short-term win. Walk away when you're up or be prepared to give it all back.

Just remember there's no professional craps players - anybody who tells you so is lying or has an illegal angle.

The first time I played craps, I ran \$500 up to 14k. The next year was a little fuzzy, but I know what I'm talking about - the house always win.

That said, have fun with your entertainment money.

Peace,

Ritter

dantheman_05
01-14-2005, 06:22 PM
thxs for the input, it is really helpfull. what about betting teh big 6 &amp;8?

tylerdurden
01-14-2005, 11:31 PM
Stay away from ALL of the other bets. Big 6 and Big 8 are really bad (~9% house edge), though not the worst bets on the table.

http://wizardofodds.com/games/craps/