What the Palestinian Authority Has Been Up To

Check the link on Drudge if you want. The Palestinian Authority has been prohibiting journalists from covering the celebrations for the terrorist attack on us. They obviously don't want us to see what crap their people actually are. Arafat has been smart enough to say the right things, but he is either not speaking for the people he alledgedly leads or is lying. Palestinian Authority OFFICERS are celebrating the attack. This cannot be chalked up to some low-level celebrations among the Palestinian version of monster truck fans. This is how a significant chunk of the Palestinian population feels. When will we learn that pandering to these people in peace talks will not work? Doesn't it make you proud that we put American credibility on the line to get significant concessions from Israel. Do you remember the reports of our Secretary of State (Albright) RUNNING after Yasser to beg him to come to the table. America should not beg countries who can hurt us (China, Russia, whomever) let alone this bunch.


End of rant, but I think we must begin to consider the Palestinian Authority as our enemy in order to deal with them appropriately in future talks and to set a new Middle Eastern policy. I don't say this because of a few crazies who celebrate; Egypt has these kinds of people too, but they have a government which can insure an appropriate policy, not one driven by these ideas. The celebrations are the true face of the Palestinian Liberation Organization, ER, "Movement" I fear.

So what course of action do you suggest we take against the Palestinians?

The Palestinians have been treated like crap by the western world since the Balfour Declaration. When you treat people like crap, they behave like crap.


I imagine a significant percentage of the Egyptian population didn't like it when Sadat met with Begin and Carter at Camp David. Sadat was ahead of his people; hopefully Arafat can be so also and insure an appropriate policy, despite what his underlings do. Celebrations of death and violence are disgusting, but there's no question that, as you say, a significant percentage of the Palestinian population hates us. Treating them as our enemy or crap will make things worse for everyone, making them hate us even more, and increasing the likelihood of additional ugly events both here and in the Middle East.

Sorry...but you're a fool. To actually believe that most people of any race/religion/whatever would celebrate the death of so many innocent people is folly. You are basically saying they are not human. It reflects your own mentality more than anything? You say "this is the way the majority of those people think?" Where did you get this? Have you ever talked to people from there? Or do you just get it from Drudge? I know lots of Muslims and Arabs (I went to college in Berkeley) They are as diverse as Christians and Jews. Sure there are angry ones but the majority of them are soft spoken and kind. There are angry Protestants and Catholics in Ireland who kill each other even today. Will you celebrate if innocent Palestinians/Arabs/Muslims are killed? Probably. But most of the rest of us won't. What about if innocent Irish children are killed? Will you react differently? I for one will react the same way.


BTW the Egyptians react more positively to us because we are trading partners for oil. Put the Palestinians in the same situation and you will get the same reaction. Open your mind...the world is not as black and white as you seem to think.

Very good post Andy, heaping violence upon violence will not help alleviate the pain of what has happened. It is tough to maintain emotional composure in times like these but please let us not all collectively go on tilt!

I don't think he was saying that all muslims or all arabs think this way. What he was saying is that the celebrations that went on in Palestine were not just a few nuts. I was watching the video, and it certainly looked to me like there was a rather general feeling of celebration. If they were celebrating the deaths of thousands of Americans, then I think it's safe to say they hate us.


***Will you celebrate if innocent Palestinians/Arabs/Muslims are killed? Probably.***


No, I would not, and I doubt that HDPM would either. That's was the point of his post: Why were these people celebrating? Why do they hate us that much?

"Why do they hate us that much?"


That's the million dollar question. I think the U.S. has to look itself in the mirror and answer this question. Not until this is done will problems with terrorists be truly resolved.

""Why were these people celebrating? Why do they hate us that much?""


I know, it is painful to see those TV images of small children gloating over America's suffering. When the pain subsides, it's good to hold that thought : Why do they do it?


If, like any sane person, you can accept that we are all biologically equal - and that, therefore, Palestinians, are not stupid neanthertals but people like you and me - then there must be a reason.


[Again, none of the above talk should distract from the absolutely criminal nature of what was done to innocent people on Tuesday. People talk about American crimes --as I have, many times-- but then put those crimes on a weight scale, as if Tuesday's barbarism balances out. Fuck that. No crime can justify another crime.]

I'll answer my own question, at least partially. They hate us that much because they have been taught to feel that way. They have been shown things which are bad and told "Americans did that." They have just as many illusions about what our country is like as we do about theirs. Perhaps more. But we don't hate them. At least we didn't before Tuesday, and hopefully we can get back to not hating them as quickly as possible. We should make an effort to discover what it is that they focus on, as justification for hating us, but even if we discover all the reasons we may not change our ways at all. Not out of a stubborn refusal to compromise, but out of a fundamental disagreement about the nature of morality. We believe in certain things because of rational arguments which support them. We believe in other things because of irrational fears and prejudices. Some of us believe in other things because they have been drilled into our heads so much that we have no choice. Nonetheless, we can distinguish between these things. We can strive to believe in more rational things and fewer irrational ones. I think a person should have the right to believe in a religion or not, based on their own judgement. I believe that a person should have the right to wear the clothing they feel is appropriate, but only if it is within the bounds of decency of the area they are in or the event they are attending. You could call this a meta-moral code, since it makes no prescription of particular standards, yet it sets out a rational basis for determining which ethical standards are acceptable.


A killer who claims that his morality demands slaughter is still a killer, and should still be dealt with as one.

Boris, right now I think the appropriate course of action is to do nothing in terms of the Palestinian Authority. But we must keep this in mind for future talks when we think of demanding something from Israel or wondering whether the Palestinian Authority can meet a certain condition. We should also reevalauate our policy towards the Palestinian question. But now is not a real good time.


Lenny, thanks for the comments, I think you saw what I was intending in a post with the potential for controversy.


John Ho, you were out of line in your response. You did not read my post carefully enough. I should not attempt to defend myself once you engaged in a personal attack, but I will in the hope you will read the post again and perhaps think of your own positions again. You said, "To actually believe that most people of any race/religion/whatever would celebrate the death of so many innocent people is folly." No, I have seen videotape of celebrations with my own eyes. I did not view it as a widespread thing at first. But after reading the Drudge link, it appeared to me that the celebrations were more widespread than originally thought and participants in them included officials of the government, such as it is. If the news report was wrong, my opinion could obviously change. But the Palestinian Authority is prohibiting coverage of these celebrations. What does that tell you? To infer from that that I am thus a racist is an error. To take that inference and then imply I am a racist and a fool is where you are out of line. My post obviously does not lump all Muslims or Arabs together. Yes, I spoke of Palestinians, but the last I looked they assert rights for themselves based on their existence as Palestinians. To speak of this group as a group in the political sense is fair game. It is folly for you to deny these celebrations are occurring. You may take something different from their existence than I do, but they are going on. It is naive to believe there are not people who celebrate innocent deaths. They are out there. My criticism of them is not that they are not human beings. It is because these people are human beings their behavior is despicable.


Your worst insult was indicating that I would celebrate the deaths of innocent Palestinians/Arabs/Muslims. That you lump these all together shows your lack of analysis of my post. I also get the impression you don't understand the gravity of this insult. I shouldn't even tell you this, because your insult really doesn't merit a response, but I will tell you I have been sickened at the deaths of some Palestinians in the ongoing fighting.


You probably should not have mentioned you went to Berkeley. I was very tempted to respond in kind to you, and the fact you went there explains a lot to someone in the mood to hurl insults. But I will refrain.