Scumbag Poker Staking

[Gata Kamsky]

What do you tell a person whom you staked for some money for 50% of the profit at a session, then lose it all but put up some of their money and win back your money and then say they don't want to pay you back because they put up their money in that session too? Eventually they lost it all which I was happy to see even though I lost my money but I really want to let them have it as it's been a while and they deserve to be put in their place?

[whiskeytown]

tell him to go to hell and stop staking him.

RB

[Greg (FossilMan)]

I don't understand. Why should they pay you back? You made a deal with them, and the deal ended when they lost the stake you put up. The fact that they then went on to win with their own money has no relationship to the deal they made with you.

I mean, if they had quit that game, come back the next day with their own money, and booked a big win, would you feel they owed you any of that win? It's the same thing, only instead of going home, sleeping for a night, and then winning, they did it without bothering to leave the table for a night's sleep first.

I think you need to learn more about staking players, or quit doing it.

Later, Greg Raymer (FossilMan)

[jakethebake]

[ QUOTE ]
What do you tell a person whom you staked for some money for 50% of the profit at a session, then lose it all but put up some of their money and win back your money and then say they don't want to pay you back because they put up their money in that session too? Eventually they lost it all which I was happy to see even though I lost my money but I really want to let them have it as it's been a while and they deserve to be put in their place?

[/ QUOTE ]
Was the deal as poorly worded as your post? I'm still trying to figure out that first sentence...

[Regulator]

I don't think that example is quite the same. The player could have used the stake as fuel for a certain kind of table image, and used his own money to reap the benefits afterwards. The same players might not be there day after day to consider this as the same session. It's hard to say that the original stake had zero bearing on the eventual winnings.

I'll admit that I don't know a lot about staking either, but what prevents someone from doing something like I mentioned? I do agree, though, that this person should have made a better and more explicitly worded deal with the player.

[jakethebake]

Don't stake scumbags, or people you don't know well.

[dakine]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think that example is quite the same. The player could have used the stake as fuel for a certain kind of table image, and used his own money to reap the benefits afterwards. The same players might not be there day after day to consider this as the same session. It's hard to say that the original stake had zero bearing on the eventual winnings.

I'll admit that I don't know a lot about staking either, but what prevents someone from doing something like I mentioned? I do agree, though, that this person should have made a better and more explicitly worded deal with the player.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're assuming the deal was not the same as Raymers. The poster should explain specifictly what the deal was before flaming off and seeking sympathy.

[krazyace5]

You better have 100% trust if you are going to stake someone, there are too many ways to get burned otherwise.

[Gata Kamsky]

Sorry, let me explain better - This person is a good player he just has never played in a real poker room, just in a home game I frequent. The only reason he went to this poker club was because I put up money for half his profit. He had some bad beats lost my money, then put up a small portion of his money, and won a large amount. What I am saying is simply that is it not wrong for him not want to pay me back considering the deal was 50% of his profit at this session, the fact he put up his money is irrelevant in my eyes as the only reason he is here is I put up the money, we had a deal for 50% of his profit at this place tonight - it wasn't worded as 50% of the profit with my money. Thirdly, I've been really nice to this person as I've given him forgiveness of debts - we played headsup for 2k and I won, he didn't have the money but while I was playing on stars in the 100-200, I won about 20k while he was around in my room for a good couple of hours watching me play. So I told him to forget the debt. It just seems this person doesn't appreciate what a deal is, or have any respect for someone's word.

[dakine]

So this person is a sort of a semi-friend with no conscience. Does that sound about right? I learned my lesson many years ago. Never!, lend money to Anyone!, especially if you're playing in the same game. (i.e. craps, poker, BJ) because you are playing against your own money. I've done it twice, and got burned once.

The first time, I got my money back but it took several months.

The second time in one of our floating crap games (vice was chasing us around town) I floated a loan to a so called friend because he was losing his butt. Several hours after the game I was declared the big "Winner." I reminded my friend about the loan and his reply was, "since you came out the big winner, you got your money back from me." After a few choice words and several weeks later no repayment. His punishment..., he was banned from every game in town, even if he had the cash. He tried to start up his own games, but was warned by "Da Boys," that he would get his butt kicked. His gambling days was over, and his wife was was very happy. Eventually he moved out of town. I was never repaid. [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]