Poker players & pros public image....

citizennobody · #1 10-26-2004, 04:08 PM

I play poker professionally with moderate to good results. I have tried working to support my family while finishing a Grad degree in Economics from UTEP, but haven’t had any luck and constantly fall back on poker and endure the pressure. I would do anything (within the rules) to win because I have 6 mouths to feed. I love this sport and I love the challenges and freedoms it has given me. I don’t have a big bankroll because I live off of mine and I haven’t gotten real lucky when I have needed to. In fact the 3 weeks I spent in Vegas were the unluckiest period of my career and I feel lucky to have only lost a $1000 (including expenses) because of all the 2 out draws that sent me to the rail everyday plus the limits I played in live action. Despite the luck, I did play extraordinarily well and I am VERY proud of that.

Besides my lackluster record, the badbeats, the slovenly players, and the stress….only ONE thing bugs me about poker. I hate people that judge the players. Phil Hellmuth is not a bad guy. Annie Duke is a wonderful person. Antonio Esfandiari, Phil Laak and Chip Reese are not maniacs. Just because you have a good or bad table image shouldn’t indict you for being certain type of person. I know that everything I do at a table is contrived and if I thought that I could put a player on tilt just by talking to them…I WOULD. I am so tired of defending Phil and Annie to the ignorami just because they heard this or that.

I sat outside the tournament room at the WSOP, taking a break one day and watched at least 50 people stop and talk to Annie. She was so polite and patient with each and everyone even when a couple asked who she was!!!! Phil is a nice guy away from the table and so are the other ‘maniacs’. Now I don’t have a lot of experience with these people but I have been around enough tournaments and seen how they comport themselves in public to make a judgment. Just because you are passionate about your play and use some acting to get reads doesn’t mean jack about who you are. I have been known to push some peoples buttons on a table but I am also a first to buy them a beer after the game.

It is the Johnny Chans, who was rude to me at the Golden Nugget when I said Hi that bother me. It is the Moneymakers that always have a smart comment outside the poker room that ruin an image. It is that player that you want to choke off the table that ruins this game for me. I would give anything to be where they are and have a good run breaking into that next level, but I don’t have the entry $$$ or the bankroll to take a chance…I have to grind away at 3/6, 4/8, 10/20, 15/30, 200max NL or any limit, for that matter, that looks good.

When are players going to get a clue and realize that they couldn’t hold a candle to these guys much less judge them. When is the stupidity going to stop. I give Moneymaker credit for playing like a rock the first few days then finally playing his rush. I give Chan credit for his back-to-back titles. I give Hellmuth credit for his 9 bracelets. I figure that if people can’t figure these guys out from the hours they have seen them on tv then they will never stand a chance. In other words….DON’T JUDGE A BOOK BY THE COVER. Quit making poker a popularity contest. Poker is a game of numbers and psychology.

drewjustdrew · #2 10-26-2004, 04:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]
only ONE thing bugs me about poker. I hate people that judge the players

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It is the Johnny Chans, who was rude to me at the Golden Nugget when I said Hi that bother me. It is the Moneymakers that always have a smart comment outside the poker room that ruin an image. It is that player that you want to choke off the table that ruins this game for me.

[/ QUOTE ]

citizennobody · #3 10-26-2004, 04:46 PM

it is the people that judge based on table image,,,theres the man and the player....they may be 2 different people

drewjustdrew · #4 10-26-2004, 05:15 PM

I see your differentiation, but in the poker arena, it is difficult to understand the experiences these people have with the public. Some people are just better at public relations than others. It should not affect your opinion of them as a person. Maybe they are perfectly friendly when they are not constantly hounded by poker groupies. Maybe they ARE jerks. It is tough to draw a conclusion based on your experiences. At least from the examples you have shared.

citizennobody · #5 10-26-2004, 05:29 PM

Well....I wasn't trying to give an exhaustive account of my experiences, I was just dangling my feet in the water to see where everyone else stood. But this is a similar discourse to what I was talking about...you would rather dissect my argument rather than provide input to the topic, which is your prerogative, but typical...

joedot · #6 10-26-2004, 06:14 PM

They knock people down so they can feel better about their own pathetic lives. I agree with everything you said. This isn't just a poker issue.

dogmeat · #7 10-26-2004, 07:52 PM

Congratulations on playing some pro poker and supporting your family. Shame on you for "hating" somebody based on a single experience with them.

With regard to most people that post here and like to tear-down the players they see (and I too have laughed at people like Hellmuth), you are right about 98% of the comments, because they are from people like you and me that don't have the experience or ability to play at the games these players that are getting "dissed" play at. Human nature, I guess. I have a lot of respect for anybody that plays high-stakes, whether cash or tourny, and plays well enough to feed a family. Consider yourself respected. If you make the TV shows at some time in the future, your game will be dissected too.

Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Blarg · #8 10-26-2004, 08:24 PM

Who cares about their public image, and if they're misunderstood? Are you married to one or one yourself, or something?

Everybody's misunderstood. It's not something reserved for poker and its players.

It often seems hard to find people who aren't fixated on celebrities, gnashing their teeth and tearing their hair out over the latest downturns of poor, poor Jennifer Lopez or Princess Diana or Tom Greene or whoever. Yet for all the drama people try so hard to inject into their lives by worrying about celebrities, they often don't even give a damn about their only family members, don't know the names of their neighbors, are only fair-weather friends, at best, and sometimes find themselves hard-pressed to remember to even feed their dogs. You know that saying, "Charity begins at home"? I think caring so very much about the problems of wealthy popular celebrities is a pretty bizarre addiction, and that all that focused attention and warm, warm loving humanity would almost always be better spent face to face, where it actually matters.

I can't imagine anything less important than whether "the madness will finally stop" regarding how nice some poker player really is or isn't.

Boylermaker · #9 10-28-2004, 12:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I love this sport and I love the challenges and freedoms it has given me.

[/ QUOTE ]

As much as I love poker, I'm not sure I can refer to it as a 'sport'. I have a hard time justifying to even myself that I can count going to a cardroom as a 'workout'. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]