The Road to Hell

Tommy,


The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and I believe you have the best of intentions.


I use the word “hell” as a metaphor, since I do not believe in it. I do not believe in satan or in the personal supernatural being that many regard as God. Of course, I also do not believe in any traditional religions. However, I do believe in the existence of good and evil. To believe otherwise would have horrendous implications.


“They see us as evil. We see them as evil. Both are right, and wrong, depending only on who is judging.”


Do you really believe this? It is a self-contradictory statement. If good and evil are solely a function of one’s personal perspective, then neither party is right nor wrong. Self-interest would be the only remaining factor to guide and motivate our behavior. We have enough psychopaths in the world without this relativistic philosophy promoting more.


I think one thing you are reacting against is the arrogant certaintly exhibited by many people, western and otherwise, that their own view of morality is the correct one. This is what caused me to reject traditional religions at an early age. While I believe that absolute good and evil exist, I do not think it is possible to be absolutely certain which is which. No matter what one’s religious or spiritual beliefs might be, it is ultimately the responsibility of each individual to strive to differentiate between good and evil based on the evidence of their senses, thoughts, and feelings. Sometimes our judgements will be wrong. Believing that something is good or evil does not make it so.


Many actions have both good and evil consequences, and reasonable people will often disagree on whether an action is predominantly good or evil; in the case of these terrorist massacres, however, I have little trouble concluding with reasonable certainty it is the latter.


As for fighting hate with hate, I do not think anyone on this forum has advocated that. I feel angry and sorry for the perpetrators of this terrorism; I do not hate them. I do think we will need to employ force to combat them, however.


Regards,


Mike

....with scumbag towel-heads. That they would kill innocent civilians shows there should be zero discussion.


Anyone who lost, or nearly lost a loved one (as I did with a son on the 23rd flr of the North Tower yesterday morning) in this act of war, who watched Palestinians cheering in the streets and wasn't turned to hatred, is either a major pussy or a hater of America. Blow the Arab bastards up. Make them as extinct as the dinosaurs. The world will be a better place.

"While I believe that absolute good and evil exist, I do not think it is possible to be absolutely certain which is which."


I disagree. I think this type of destruction is evil. How can it not be?


"I feel angry and sorry for the perpetrators of this terrorism; I do not hate them."


I find this an interesting point. I was once told by a school teacher, 'you don't hate someone, you hate what they do.' If these people are so sick and dusillusioned that they believe what they have done is right, I too feel sorry for them. The situation is just so messed up. A mate of mine met a young boy in his world travels, who had a picture of Yasser in his wallet, and was claiming "I die for this man, I die for him'. He was 14. Seeing people dancing in the streets rejoicing at this destruction is sickening. How can any religion see violence as a positive?


Miles...So What?

Sadly I think your point is true. Our world would be a better place, but not theirs. At this stage I am not ready to contemplate their side of things, as I am sure many are not. I am an Australian, and not patriotic to any extreme degree, but seeing the cheering Palestinians made me want to inflict physical harm on them. I felt sick in the stomach. My only joy came from knowing these pathetic humans probably live in disease infested shanty towns, suffering from illnesses you and me are cured from by taking a pill, sharing a toilet with 100 feral relatives, and generally living a pathetic quality of life. They have nothing to lose.


Miles..So What?

I am very sorry for your loss. I cannot say that if I had suffered a similar loss, I would not feel as you do. I believe military action will be an appropriate part of America's response to this massacre. I also believe we will be more likely to achieve the goal of preventing future terrorism if our response is not motivated by hate.


Sincerely,


Mike

My assertion that absolute certainty regarding moral questions is not justifiable stems from the value I place on humility and being open-minded. It is a matter of principle. When people are absolutely certain of the correctness of their position, there is no need for them to consider other viewpoints or contradictory evidence. This is dangerous.


Though acceptance of my human fallibity prevents me from claiming absolute certainty on questions of good and evil, I agree that it is difficult to imagine how these attacks could be anything other than evil.

Agree with a lot of what MJS is saying in terms of moral judgment. We must be willing to judge good and evil, although the rational ability which allows us to judge such matters also allows us to see the possibility that our judgment is imperfect. We know we may make mistakes, but that does not absolve us of the responsibility of exercising our judgment. It should temper our judgment, but not eliminate it.

As meager of an offering as this is I offer my condolences to you for your loss. When the final death toll is known how pertinent are the arguments for a different foreign policy and a enlightened action? Where do we draw the line and say that our survival is at stake? Is it 2,000 dead; 5,000 dead; 10,000 dead; 50,000 dead; 100,000 dead; 6,000,000 dead? For me the line has been crossed as it’s our survival at stake now. God help us if these people ever make a weapon of mass destruction.

"Blow the Arab bastards up?"


Most Arabs are appalled by these events and to suggest that Arabs should be blown up is disgusting.


Because some members of a group behave dispicably doesn't justify hatred of all of them.