A bubble hand with some context

durron597 · #1 06-15-2005, 12:13 PM

I'm most interested in my play in the third hand. But I think the hand I care about is read dependant, so I'm posting a few hands to give a little bit of context. Villian was playing pretty tight preflop, and the posted hands is where he got his stack from. Note that I agonized forever before calling the first one. I decided that I was ahead here enough of the time that the 2:1 odds were correct to call. The other two hands I was not involved in, they are just there for context reasons.

Context hand #1:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t150 (7 handed) converter

MP1 (t3110)
MP2 (t705)
CO (t1975)
Hero (t3320)
SB (Villian) (t805)
BB (t2815)
UTG (t770)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
4 folds, Hero raises to t400, SB (Villian) calls t325, 1 fold.

Flop: (t950) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Villian bets t405 (All-In), Hero calls t405.

Turn: (t1760) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: (t1760) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: t1760

Results in white below: 
Hero has 7s Kh (one pair, kings).
Villian has Qc Jc (straight, ace high).
Outcome: Villian wins t1760. 

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (6 handed) converter

CO (t3710)
Button (t1455)
SB (t1720)
Hero (t2590)
UTG (Villian) (t1810)
MP (t2215)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG (Villian) raises to t800, 3 folds, SB calls t700, 1 fold.

Flop: (t1800) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets t920 (All-In), Villian calls t920.

Turn: (t3640) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: (t3640) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: t3640

Results in white below: 
Villian has Kh As (high card, ace).
SB has Qh Th (high card, queen).
Outcome: Villian wins t3640. 

Context hand #3:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (5 handed) converter

UTG (t3230)
MP (t2785)
Hero (t2565)
SB (Villian) (t3305)
BB (t1615)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls t200, 2 folds, SB (Villian) completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t600) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
Villian checks, BB bets t1390 (All-In), UTG folds, Villian calls t1390.

Turn: (t3380) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: (t3380) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: t3380

Results in white below: 
Villian has 8d 7s (one pair, sevens).
BB has 3d As (one pair, threes).
Outcome: Villian wins t3380. 

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Now the hand I care about (without results for now). Note that the following is the hand immediately after the previous hand. Also this is the first hand with a t25 ante.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (4 handed) converter

SB (t3005)
BB (t2760)
Hero (t2540)
Button (Villian) (t5195)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Hero raises to t600, Button (Villian) calls t600, 2 folds.

Flop: (t1275) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets t500, Villian raises to t1600,

Sabrazack · #2 06-15-2005, 12:20 PM

Sure, he seems like a total moron. But a moron would call your preflop bet with alot of wierd hands. And any five, seven or higher pocket pair is ahead of you here. In the hands you posted he pushed when he has a straight draw, the other two hands he checked, and then called. So that leads me to believe he has something here, either a flushdraw or a higher pair. And i think he has a higher pair often enough for you to fold this. Had you had a pair of sevens however you coulda gladly pushed.

TStokes · #3 06-15-2005, 12:48 PM

I agree, with the types of hands he was getting all in with earlier I think you have to lay this down. I think you are left with around 1500. A couple of steals and you are right back even with the others.

durron597 · #4 06-15-2005, 01:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Sure, he seems like a total moron. But a moron would call your preflop bet with alot of wierd hands. And any five, seven or higher pocket pair is ahead of you here. In the hands you posted he pushed when he has a straight draw, the other two hands he checked, and then called. So that leads me to believe he has something here, either a flushdraw or a higher pair. And i think he has a higher pair often enough for you to fold this. Had you had a pair of sevens however you coulda gladly pushed.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you agree with my flop bet? Do you bet more, do you check?

Freudian · #5 06-15-2005, 01:39 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Do you agree with my flop bet? Do you bet more, do you check?

[/ QUOTE ]

Judging by the previous hands he just might be the kind of player that check when he miss the flop (which means you will find out where you are even if you check).

And yes, you have to lay this one down. The raise should mean you are beat most of the time.

durron597 · #6 06-15-2005, 01:55 PM

[ QUOTE ]

Judging by the previous hands he just might be the kind of player that check when he miss the flop (which means you will find out where you are even if you check).

[/ QUOTE ]

He called an allin with A high. Of course it was a correct call, but that leads me to believe he would probably bet with A high too.

pergesu · #7 06-15-2005, 02:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t150 (7 handed) converter

MP1 (t3110)
MP2 (t705)
CO (t1975)
Hero (t3320)
SB (Villian) (t805)
BB (t2815)
UTG (t770)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
4 folds, Hero raises to t400, SB (Villian) calls t325, 1 fold.

Flop: (t950) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Villian bets t405 (All-In), Hero calls t405.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm curious as to what inspired this call. You just don't take [censored] from a stop and goer?

durron597 · #8 06-15-2005, 02:11 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm curious as to what inspired this call. You just don't take [censored] from a stop and goer?

[/ QUOTE ]

Basically I decided that the pot was laying me such a good price, and the SB was basically committed no matter what, that I decided he was stop-and-going me often enough for the call to be correct. That combined with the fact Gigabet's post in the back of my mind made this a call (my stack isn't crippled if I call and lose).

pergesu · #9 06-15-2005, 02:15 PM

If it's reversed, YOU're stop and going enough to make the call correct. But the play takes an especially good or especially bad player. I assume, from your initial post, that you had no reason to believe he was any good. But did you have reason to believe he was a truly awful player that would by ultraaggressive here?

The odds are nice here, and I'd probably call with like a KQ, cause a lot of players are doing this with something like K9. Problem is, the average player is doing this with something like K9...

Freudian · #10 06-15-2005, 02:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
That combined with the fact Gigabet's post in the back of my mind made this a call (my stack isn't crippled if I call and lose).

[/ QUOTE ]

I predict we will see this comment often in the future.