Best Live Players

We all have a pretty decent idea who are some of the best tournement players around. I am curious to find out who people think are some of the best players around playing live limit poker....hold em or omaha 8 or better preferrably.


If others find a discussion like this interesting lets set things up to discuss say the following limits:


50-100


200-400


400-800.


Hope others will find this interesting enough to drop their two cents in.

I can't provide the insight that the Mason's of the world can on this issue, but I've heard numerous times that Ted Forrest is hands down the best super high limit player around.


Josh

You are kidding yourself if you think you can figure this out. The very best players are guys you never heard of playing in games you haven't heard of either. Besides who is a better player, one who is more effective beating the full-table game or the short-table when 75% of the time the big limit game goes short? Are you going to take any deviations into consideration? Would you like to be the guy that makes a BB an hour in a big game with lots of fluctuation or the guy making 0.5 BB/hour with much less fluctuation (hence smaller needed bankroll)? Even with all this decided, remember player number 3 on the list might be better than player number 1 depending on the fields he plays against. Lots of number ones have fallen quickly as slight changes in playing styles or the addition of just one distinct player to a regular lineup can ruin his previously best game. I guess in a way what Mason or any other expert will tell you is absolutely forget it on this question, there is no way you can answer it with any kind of certainty. Just remember anyone that can get a consistent edge against the huge game is a great player, someone who is in all likelihood better than almost any player you can name.

I Agree with you wildbill 100% !

Interesting response. I am not sure that I would simply give up on something like this. To answer one of your questions, I would always rate the player with the higher BB per hour rate over the lower one with smaller fluctuations.


You are correct that in different games different people may rank above one another. But that does not mean one cannot make a generalization.


Further, I was not talking about players who play 20,000-40,000 hold em any way. I was curious as to who people have seen at the levels of 50-100 to 400-800. The most interesting point that I would find from this is that if we had 50 people put names up of players they have actually played against at these sorts of limits, at least 20 of the players most people who never have heard of.


For example, I have found players like Ron Moore and Boonie to be among the best I have ever played against. How many out there have ever even heard of either of them? Played against them?


Just my thoughts.

A while back I think Wild Bill posted about a guy he knows who plays high limit private cash games. Higher than 400-800, lower than 10K-20K as I recall. I don't think anyone will say a whole lot about these games. He did say these private game players could make 500K or so in a good year. These guys aren't going to be posting. I talked to one guy once who had just a little experience in such games when someone staked him. It sounded interesting. I don't get invitations to these games either. :-)

I'd love to see some kind of rating system set up for ring game players. You'd have to set up special tables for 'official rated ring games', and have special rules for recording each buy in and cash out. But, I think it would be a lot of fun. Something analagous to a golfer handicap card.


Drawbacks would be that it would be difficult to police, and the bad players would get identified more easily and would quit playing in these games from embarrassment...

Go to Cardplayer's website. Check the June 22, 2002 issue for the player's poll. This poll covers many live-action catagories.

I remember reading that poll and talking to someone about it. He laughed and said, that is purely a "reputation" poll. Further its guys that play almost all in public games in LV or CA. You want the real stars, you won't find them! As for the suggestion about thinking you can figure it out, forget it, you won't be able to. Sorry your question gets answered this way, but its the plain and simple truth. If you listed say 20 players that are known and named, well then maybe some of those that play with them could tell you who the best is out of that group. That wouldn't tell you who the best overall is. Mike Sexton wrote about this before, he didn't even reveal half he knows about this subject I am sure! Rest assured, knowing who is the best is something you will never know for sure. You might know who some of the best are, but don't ever think you know who the best is. After all its the same way in tournaments. Men the Master was player of the year, but can you say he was the best? He certainly is a long-term winner and no one would doubt his credentials, but winning tournaments has a luck element to it. Also he plays almost every tournament, every game too. Yet he has never won the WSOP championship, so could you say he is the best? Ranking players whether tournaments or live games is just an exercise in futility. You can figure out who solid winners are, just not who is better than another.

you can make whatever arguement you want but the best player without a doubt is Teddy Forrest. he got to play really really big because he beat all of the other limits to get there. i also know that there are a large number of unbelievably good players who we will never hear of, and they like it that way, but we all know about Ted for one reason, because he is the best--at any limit--and it would be hard for anyone to prove that fact wrong, because none of us want to play against him for any amount.