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#11
08-08-2005, 02:59 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
[ QUOTE ]
this forum has to lear how to play postflop, you guys are so terrified about giving free cards. [/ QUOTE ]When is giving free cards when you have VERY marginal holdings a good idea? A strong hand to let villain catch a little something, sure, but how can you bet the turn when an overcard pops up? 
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#12
08-08-2005, 03:01 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
[ QUOTE ]
this forum has to lear how to play postflop, you guys are so terrified about giving free cards. [/ QUOTE ] I'm sorry but I really can't see how checkraising could be some kind of a standard play in the 20+2's here. Feel free to teach me and us though. I understand that checkraising would be nice if you knew that button would often bet and fold to a raise. I just don't see that being the case here. Isn't it pretty ABC to be terrified of giving away free cards with a crappy jack top pair on a straight+flush coordinated board against two opponents who can be holding pretty much anything even in a cash game? Add to that the fact that you are in a tournament where you especially want to reduce the risk of going broke even if it slightly damages your CEV. Of course you haven't necessarily lost the hand if the turn card comes, but a large portion of the turn cards are scary to you, and you don't have position to help you there.
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#14
08-08-2005, 03:04 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
[ QUOTE ]
this forum has to lear how to play postflop, you guys are so terrified about giving free cards. [/ QUOTE ] You single-handidly destroyed any arugment you had at the start of the sentence by the time you finished it. Youre playing the odds, and by giving free cards you are granting unlimited odds. I can cite off the top of my head 3 books that say to never give free cards and to value survival over slighlty better EV. "A mistake that cost you the pot is a catastrophe, a mistake that costs you a bet is not." Dont be greedy, theres two shortstacks and they cant take the blinds much longer. Take the 450 pot with a solid bet here, run from resistance from the bigstack because he CHOSE to play his hand, which means if he thinks its worth a raise than its likely better than the J rag youre playing.
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#15
08-08-2005, 03:05 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
[ QUOTE ]
this forum has to lear how to play postflop, you guys are so terrified about giving free cards. [/ QUOTE ] Trying to check-raise here is awful IMO and I'm a big fan of ill-advised checkraises.
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#16
08-08-2005, 03:09 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
The bigstack limped a hand which could be anything, but probably isnt. It will be given a standard, loose range of calling:
Ax suited Two face cards A low-mid PP maybe a suited connector Of these hands, bigstack wont be raising unless he caught. When he's caught, our J with a 5 kicker will be good about 10% of the time, that 10% is when hes raising a midpair and i dont think he would make that play here. He could be calling with many hands i supposed but i dont think hes folding to 300 but calling for 250, and i want to keep the pot small against him with the two other players so close to done. I dont think you have the stack to bet 400 and then turtle up on the turn since almost every card in the deck scares you. I say make your bet, try and take it here and if you meet resistance from the shortstack go for it, if its from the bigstack pick a better time.
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#17
08-08-2005, 03:19 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
Well, some people tend to bet this flop with a flush draw, 66+, overcards, and just hands in general. Then again, these people don't limp preflop with t150 blinds either.
So, I think your ranges are right, but it clearly isn't a good idea to bet only if you've caught here. So, t250, folding to a raise, shoving most turns, I think.
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#18
08-08-2005, 03:22 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
[ QUOTE ]
c/r that [censored] like every single day [/ QUOTE ] You guys really don't think that the bigstack is going to put a bet out on the button here after two checks? I do.
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#19
08-08-2005, 03:50 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] c/r that [censored] like every single day [/ QUOTE ] You guys really don't think that the bigstack is going to put a bet out on the button here after two checks? I do. [/ QUOTE ] If you bet out and got put all-in by the big stack do you call?
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#20
08-08-2005, 03:57 AM
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Re: How do you play this?
Without a read, no.
And I think we think Big stack is a donk, and donks often don't bet here.
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