Two Plus Two Older Archives  

Go Back   Two Plus Two Older Archives > Other Topics > The Stock Market
FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 06-24-2005, 06:28 PM
RunDownHouse RunDownHouse is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 165
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE)

Just some more data on PFE for you guys:

Metric.............'04.........'03........'02
FCFY.................7.4%........(25.7).....3.6
EBV/share.........$22.81.......11.33......17.58
P/EBV...............1.18..........3.12.......1.74
NOPAT margin...25.2%.......15.6.......27.4
IC Turns...........25.............22.........24
EPM .............(1.1%)........(4.2).......(1.5)

FCFY: free cash flow yield
EBV/share: economic book value per share
IC turns: invested capital turns
EPM: economic profit margin


Their 2003 numbers are a sort of blip because they had a ton of write-offs for merger related expenses, in-process R&D, and asset impairments (over $6B). Still, they look good from the quick glance I gave them. Relatively cheap, but not so-cheap-something-must-be-wrong cheap, good NOPAT margin and FCFY.

Their negative EPM is a bit worrisome, but only a little, because they look so good despite that. If they achieved an EPM of even 0, they'd probably see some good price appreciation. Essentially, they're pumping a ton of capital into their business (IC turns) - as all big pharms tend to do - but not getting an acceptable return on it. So it all comes down to what's in their pipeline, as has been mentioned.

It would be interesting to hear if anybody had some good qualitative research on what their pipeline is like and any management plans to bring EPM up, since all I have is pretty much quant stuff.

EDIT: Past performance is no guarantee of future performance, this is not intended to be serious investment advice, etc. Don't go out and put everything you own on this stock. Also, we've got PFE's beta at .85, for the poster that asked in the other thread.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-24-2005, 07:03 PM
alekhine8 alekhine8 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 89
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE)

They generate a lot of cash - about $13.7 billion of free cash flow (cash flows from operating activities less capital expenditures) in 2004, and another $2.7 billion in the first quarter this year. Of that, they are paying out a little over a third in dividends - the current dividend yield is about 2.6% which definitely helps.

The Lipitor patent goes until 2010 - this drug is seeing huge growth unlikely to change anytime soon. However, there are either FDA issues (Celebrex) or patent expiration issues in the next three years (Norvasc, Zoloft and Neurontin) on their next four largest drugs. That said, I wouldn't be too worried. They spent $7.7 billion on R&D last year and will probably be around there this year as well.

They have announced cost-cutting measures and intentions to repurchase shares. They are not saddled with debt. While they are in a business that is potentially subject to expensive litigation, unless things went haywire on several of their drug offerings, they'll be fine. Frankly, even a few billion in litigation costs on one of their current or future drugs wouldn't be a deal-breaker for me.

If you are buying for the long-term (10+ years), I think it is a great buy - especially if you participate in the dividend reinvestment program through Equiserve (www.equiserve.com). With a minimum initial purchase of $500 (and optional monthly purchases of $50+ per month), you can buy the stock and have your dividends reinvested for free. It's worth checking out.

Good luck.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-24-2005, 07:57 PM
James Boston James Boston is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Alabama
Posts: 314
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE)

I just ran my spreadsheet for valuating the value of all future FCF. I only input the past 6 years when I do that, and generally apply it to companies that have steady performance. PFE's net income grew by nearly 300% from '03 to '04, and that's not going to happen repeatedly so it threw my numbers WAY OFF. My FCF growth rate for the past 5 years came out to 58%. At 15% FCF growth, the discounted present value of future FCF should put the company at being worth roughly 450 billion dollars, its market cap is 212 billion. I could be off somewhere though.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-24-2005, 10:40 PM
alekhine8 alekhine8 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 89
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE)

I ran a FCF analysis assuming increases of 10% to cash flows from operations and slight increases in capital expenditures, and came up with a $228.9b valuation assuming a 10% discount rate. That is roughly $30.80 per share or about 8% over the current price.

Like I said before, I think its a good buy if you are going to compound dividends for 10+ years, but I wouldn't look for a 25% return anytime soon unless they bring something new to the market or do something else big.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 06-24-2005, 10:41 PM
AceHigh AceHigh is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1,173
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE)

[ QUOTE ]
at a PE of 13

[/ QUOTE ]

P/E is more like 23.
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=pfe

Isn't the Viagra problem going to hurt them?
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in698124.shtml
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 06-24-2005, 10:57 PM
James Boston James Boston is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Alabama
Posts: 314
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE)

[ QUOTE ]
assuming a 10% discount rate

[/ QUOTE ]

I used 8%

[ QUOTE ]
and slight increases in capital expenditures

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't use this. I just take 6 years of FCF, get the FCF growth rate from those 6 years, and go from there.

I find your model interesting. Maybe I should be using a 10% discount factor. The 30-year T-bill has historically yielded approx. 8%, but a safe 10% return isn't an unreasonable assumption.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 06-24-2005, 11:26 PM
alekhine8 alekhine8 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 89
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE)

Either way, you probably get to a similar result. I used 10% because that is what I feel I can reasonably get with a boring S&P index fund over the long run, and I would want a stock that would significantly outperform that.

We'll see! Good luck.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 06-25-2005, 02:32 AM
Josh W Josh W is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 647
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE) -NKTR

I just glanced through this thread, and I don't know a lot, but I'm surprised nobody said anything about Nektar.

Nektar Theraputics (NKTR) is working on an inhalable insulin device. This is currently being tested in Europe, and a ruling is expected to come down from the EU "soon". Pfizer, I think, is developing the administering device for this medicine.

Like I said, I don't know much, but a coworker of mine is huge on NKTR, and I know they have a close relationship with PFE. NKTR is somewhere aroung $18/share, and my coworker thinks that if a favorable ruling comes from the EU, it could skyrocket (obviously a gamble).

I would think that PFE would also be tied to the impending ruling from the EU....does anybody have any more specific info on this?

Josh
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 06-25-2005, 02:43 AM
James Boston James Boston is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Alabama
Posts: 314
Default Re: Stock of the Day- Pfizer (PFE)

I'm going to take it upon myself to close this thread, but others can still elaborate if they wish. PFE=good investment if you're in it for the long haul. Anyone disagree?
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:29 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.