The Crusades

[nicky g]

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totalitarianism is largely a 20th century phenomena

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You have just proved you don't know dik about history and therefore it is likely the rest of your opinions are bunk as well. How many examples of representative democracy do you think there are between Athens and the founding of the U.S.? Here's 2: The Althing of Iceland and the English parliament (oligarchy until 20th century there). How many others?

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A lack of democracy is not remotely the same of totalitarianism. Totalitarianisn is an all-encompassing system that tries to regulate every aspect of life and is generally characterised by mass murder. The most prominent exampoles are Nazi Germany and Stalinist Russia. It is not the same as dictatorship or a myriad of other political systems. But thanks for demonstrating your rudeness and ignorance in one shot.

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Yea, I'm sure the peasants and serfs of pre-modern times didn't really feel like their lives were regulated or that whether they lived or died was at the whim of the ruler or ruling class. And I am sure they felt that they would always receive fair and impartial justice.

[nicky g]

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Yea, I'm sure the peasants and serfs of pre-modern times didn't really feel like their lives were regulated or that whether they lived or died was at the whim of the ruler or ruling class. And I am sure they felt that they would always receive fair and impartial justice.

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I seriously doubt they felt that a ruling ideology such as Nazism permeated their every action, transaction and thought. Pre-modern governments simply didn't have the power or technology to extend into every aspect of their subjects' lives even if they had wanted to. Look, if you want to argue that totalitarianism is simply any authoritarian non-democratic system be my guest, but that's not what it is commonly understood as. It really is quite sad that your mind is so narrow and inflexible that you only have space for one type of illegitimate violence in it (terrorism) and one type of non-perfect political system (totalitarianism). Thank God the world and most people's minds are more varied than yours.

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Yea nicky, it really pays to keep an open mind so that you can distinguish between different forms of violence and the nuances of differing forms of dictatorship. That way you don't discriminate against forms of violence and those dictatorships that you have sympathy with or are just too cowardly to confront.

How noble and sophisticated of you.

[nicky g]

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Yea nicky, it really pays to keep an open mind so that you can distinguish between different forms of violence and the nuances of differing forms of dictatorship. That way you don't discriminate against forms of violence and those dictatorships that you have sympathy with or are just too cowardly to confront.

How noble and sophisticated of you.

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It is not a question of not confronting or having sympathy with forms of violence or repressive violence. But l;umping them altogether is absurd; I'd much rather live under some tinpot dictatorship that leaves you alone if you mind your own business than Stalinist Russia for example. I'd rather live in Egypt now than in Cambodia under Pol Pot. And I see a distinction between shooting someone for money and blowing up a cafe for political motives, despite the fact that both are wrong. Lumping them all in together is ridiculous.

I'll come back to your Quranic excerpts tonight or tomorrow; but let me quickly say firstly that context matters, and secondly that noone, not even MMMMMM [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img], believes that Islam or the Qur'an demand that everyone convert to Islam or be killed as you suggest.

[MMMMMM]

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I'll come back to your Quranic excerpts tonight or tomorrow; but let me quickly say firstly that context matters, and secondly that noone, not even MMMMMM , believes that Islam or the Qur'an demand that everyone convert to Islam or be killed as you suggest.


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Right, because the third choice for infidels (other than conversion of death), is to accept humiliating second-class legal status under Islam as dhimmis and to pay the (extortionate) special poll tax.

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I love how MM claims to have "read the Koran."

What a tool. I didn't know he read Arabic, but I love his "absolutist" "fascist" positions he so circularly maintains.

Total [censored] tool.

[BluffTHIS!]

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I'll come back to your Quranic excerpts tonight or tomorrow; but let me quickly say firstly that context matters


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Always trying to find a way out of the plain meaning of the words aren't you? And like MMMMMM posted above and I commented on, the standard is not how you interpret it, but how Moslems do and act on it.

[MMMMMM]

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I'll come back to your Quranic excerpts tonight or tomorrow; but let me quickly say firstly that context matters


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Always trying to find a way out of the plain meaning of the words aren't you? And like MMMMMM posted above and I commented on, the standard is not how you interpret it, but how Moslems do and act on it.


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The thing is, most Muslims are moderate enough to not really follow the Koran in its entirety (thankfully). However, the religious authorities of Islam generally take views that we would call "extreme." That's because the Koran itself contains prescriptions for thought and action which we would call "extreme."