baseball scoring question

[tdarko]

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That rule is even dumber than not assuming a double play. How can the defense making an error cost the batter? It doesn't make any sense.

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yeah there is some luck involved in this game.

[PhatTBoll]

According to the Sporting News:

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In 1908, the sacrifice fly was introduced, crediting the batter with a sacrifice fly only if a runner scores after the ball is caught. The following year, a provision was added to allow the scorer to award a sacrifice fly even if the ball is dropped for an error if the scorer believes that the runner would have scored. Beginning in 1926, the batter was credited with a sacrifice fly is "any runner advances after the catch." In 1931, the "awarding of sacrifice flies is abolished." For one season in 1939, the sac fly returns, but is eliminated again in 1940.

The sacrifice rule returns for good in 1954. "Also score a sacrifice if, with less than two out, the batter hits a fair fly ball which is caught, and a runner scores after the catch, or is dropped for an error, and a runner scores, if in the scorer's judgment, the runner could have scored after the catch had the fly been caught."

In 1975, the rule was altered to include foul fly balls as well.

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Looks like the batter gets credit for a sac after all.

Link

[tdarko]

rules have changed since then but if you can link me to this happening in a big league game then i will have learned something new today.

two years in a minor league game this happened and the hitter was credited an AB but of course minor leagues are sketchy with stats.

[The Stranger]

Rule 10.8

(e) Score a sacrifice fly when, before two are out, the batter hits a fly ball or a line drive handled by an outfielder or an infielder running in the outfield which (1) is caught, and a runner scores after the catch, or (2) is dropped, and a runner scores, if in the scorer's judgment the runner could have scored after the catch had the fly been caught. NOTE: Score a sacrifice fly in accordance with 10.09 (e) (2) even though another runner is forced out by reason of the batter becoming a runner.

[pryor15]

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if there is a runner on 1st and 3rd and the batter hits a sharp groundball to the shortstop and he steps on second and has the batter out by a mile at first but throws in 4 rows deep out of play it is an earned run for the pitcher since you cannot assume a double play.

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that run would be unearned. you can't assume the double play, but you can assume the out at first in that situation. if the SS tosses to 2B and the 2B drops it, then you don't assume the double play, since the first out wasn't recorded. the runner at second is "unearned" b/c he should have been out on the flip from SS, but the batter is "earned", since you can't assume the double play.

on the other example, i think you're 0-1, but i'd have to think about it. i'd guess you can't just assume the runner on third would score (or even attempt to score, you never know) think Cecil Fielder vs. Vlad's arm

[The Dude]

tdarko, the rule about never assuming a double play has nothing to do with the question. The batter would be credited with a sac fly and an RBI. In fact, this exact situation came up in a Dodgers game already this year (it was in their home opener, I believe).

[LotsOfOuts69]

Remember, this is the sport where if there are 2 outs and no one on, and you hit a dribbler back to the pitcher, and he throws it into the stands, and then proceeds to give up 20 straight homeruns, he gets no earned runs on his record.
Even despite the fact that it was HIS error.

[FishNChips]

he gets the rbi? I was under the belief that an error nullifies the rbi, but I hadn't thought of this situation specifically.

interesting question.

[Voltron87]

So does anyone know whether the run was earned or unearned?

[Bulldog]

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Remember, this is the sport where if there are 2 outs and no one on, and you hit a dribbler back to the pitcher, and he throws it into the stands, and then proceeds to give up 20 straight homeruns, he gets no earned runs on his record.
Even despite the fact that it was HIS error.

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As it should be. Earned runs and ERA are basic measures of pitching ability. The fact that he threw the ball into the stands had to do with his defensive ability, and nothing to do with his pitching ability.